[DocMarshall]

Some of the Genesis models look pretty good, but I can't shake the affiliation with Hyundai. They make a decent product now, but back when they started, they were junk.

[blackpear]

Originally Posted by DocMarshall

Some of the Genesis models look pretty good, but I can't shake the affiliation with Hyundai. They make a decent product now, but back when they started, they were junk.

They are the Hyundai premium brand, not just an affiliation .

To me, their interior styling takes its cues from 50s/60s American models. It looked fantastic back then but I can do without that elaborate chromed retro look.

[DocMarshall]

I realize they are Hyundai. That is why I'll never own one. I had one of the early Hyundai's when I was younger and it was such a POS I vowed never to again buy one.

[Sportstick]

Originally Posted by DocMarshall

I realize they are Hyundai. That is why I'll never own one. I had one of the early Hyundai's when I was younger and it was such a POS I vowed never to again buy one.

I get it. I felt the same way after an Audi 100LS many decades ago. Then, my wife fell in love with a brand-new A6 and after all these years, I relented. It was still/again very poor quality (POS, indeed!) and frequently being repaired. We dumped it after 18 months. My pledge was renewed! Never again, Audi. And, no, it doesn’t matter how “premium” they make a low-quality car!

[myg45]

Originally Posted by Sportstick

I get it. I felt the same way after an Audi 100LS many decades ago. Then, my wife fell in love with a brand-new A6 and after all these years, I relented. It was still/again very poor quality (POS, indeed!) and frequently being repaired. We dumped it after 18 months. My pledge was renewed! Never again, Audi. And, no, it doesn’t matter how “premium” they make a low-quality car!

What about BMW? I would like to get one, but many people (including neighbors) say Never again just like you. That makes me think twice.

[Sportstick]

Originally Posted by myg45

What about BMW? I would like to get one, but many people (including neighbors) say Never again just like you. That makes me think twice.

Neither the cars nor the corporate customer support people at BMW ever treated me with dishonesty and disregard or produced as low a quality car for me as did Audi. This is our seventh BMW and not my last. Check the brand recommendations at Consumer Reports, who has large sample data based on their subscriber base…not from enthusiasts, as one wouldn’t expect from CR.

[cfm56d7b]

BMW undoubtedly made a conscious decision to accept the risks of perceived quality erosion while reducing costs. It’s not something a premium car manufacturer takes lightly. But cars have to be profitable and now it’s up to the market - and BMW drivers - to accept it or not.

The sales statistics will tell a story when released.

[SnowCover]

back when I bought my first BMW, a 5-series, I instantly felt like I was in a premium car. Back then, other cars felt cheap.

Fast forward 20 years to 2024. I drove a brand-new 540i at the dealer. After the test drive, I honestly didn't get the "premium" feeling. Don't get me wrong, it was very nice, but just didn't have the premium vibe.

The 2023 and earlier X3 also felt just okay to me. Almost like another average SUV, just more expensive with more expensive options. Still not the premium feeling.

I have a 2025 X3 on order and I fully expect to feel the same. To be honest, if I want a premium SUV, I'll probably walk across the street to the Porsche dealer... or even Range Rover dealer.

[Sportstick]

Originally Posted by SnowCover

... or even Range Rover dealer.

I understand Porsche, but take a look at the end of the second paragraph in post #14 above before you do that!

[myg45]

Originally Posted by Sportstick

Neither the cars nor the corporate customer support people at BMW ever treated me with dishonesty and disregard or produced as low a quality car for me as did Audi. This is our seventh BMW and not my last. Check the brand recommendations at Consumer Reports, who has large sample data based on their subscriber base…not from enthusiasts, as one wouldn’t expect from CR.

Thanks for your feedback @Sportstick. I also subscribe to Consumer Reports. I'm surprised that BMW is up in quality in the last 2 or 3 years. The iXM and the X5 are examples. Now, it is just a waiting game. Let's see what will come.

[SnowCover]

Originally Posted by Sportstick

I understand Porsche, but take a look at the end of the second paragraph in post #14 above before you do that!

"low quality/high premiumness: Jaguar"

I agree with that completely. The Jaguar that I used to love is no more. My aunt once bought a brand new Jaguar XJR(?) and it screamed premium/luxury. For the love of god, the floormats were sheepskin and my shoes literally sank into them. There were also walnut burl fold-down tray tables that looked as nice as the wood on a $126k Bosendorfer piano.

[Rayneman]

I'm looking to move from my current 330 to an X3 sometime early '25. Having been a passenger in an X3 previously, I thought they were very nice, especially the last few years' models...but now I am starting to get worried about this next generation.

My worst consistent fit and finish gripe with the 3 series cars I've had is BMWs propensity to stick hard, plastic surfaces against one another that will cause the eventual and annoying (to me) creaking that sounds like an empty plastic water bottle being lightly squeezed. My current M Sport 330 is pretty fantastic in all respects, and at this point this plastic stuff is at a minimum, but I read about that potential quality and cost-cutting issues of the G45 and I am pretty worried.

In any event, I am looking forward to a real, unbiased review of one of these. I'm hoping the G45 is not a plastic nightmare.

[JK479]

Originally Posted by Ravenous666

Sale for the G45 seems to be lagging in Germany too. A fully loaded M50 is now around €96000,- including VAT which equals $106000,-.

I recently spoke to some people who ordered a G45 and they got up to 17% off MSRP. Placing a request on different car sales platforms got me 13-15% instantly.

17% is huge for a new model launch of the former best selling BMW line.

My 2020 X3 is flawless and I'm also yet unsure if I should order a new M50. Will take a look on the interior first and decide after getting an offer from my local dealer.

17 percent off in the USA? That’s wild. I can’t believe that.

[Ravenous666]

Originally Posted by JK479

17 percent off in the USA? That’s wild. I can’t believe that.

Germany

[JK479]

Originally Posted by Ravenous666

Germany

Makes sense- here it’s 7-8 depending on your favorable relationship with Client Advisor.

[avi66]

Originally Posted by blackpear

They are the Hyundai premium brand, not just an affiliation .

To me, their interior styling takes its cues from 50s/60s American models. It looked fantastic back then but I can do without that elaborate chromed retro look.

Not only that, but the engine options in US are different to those offered in the UK. Last time I checked the UK models there was no six cylinder option, only 4 pot.

[avi66]

Originally Posted by JK479

17 percent off in the USA? That’s wild. I can’t believe that.

Uk is now at 12% and rising. If BMW sales don’t go to plan here, the APR will drop on BMW PCP, and discounts will probably plateau at 14%.

[JK479]

Originally Posted by avi66

Uk is now at 12% and rising. If BMW sales don’t go to plan here, the APR will drop on BMW PCP, and discounts will probably plateau at 14%.

My local store has a huge issue with all the Stop Sale cars. Which is delaying builds.

[avi66]

Originally Posted by JK479

My local store has a huge issue with all the Stop Sale cars. Which is delaying builds.

It’s a big issue for BMW period. 320k cars not yet delivered on recall/sales stop.

Between this and a slow down in the Chinese market BMW has paused production at its Dingolfing plat affect ping 12000 staff.

[Montaver]

Agree with a lot of comments here. It’s clearly been cost cut into the ground in terms of materials and design which is disappointing, but I have no doubt it will be very well screwed together. The engineers themselves admitted as much on the cost cutting in the first drive interviews, given the key development decisions were made during the pandemic. It’s a very low effort release from BMW considering it’s their top seller. I think that biggest challenge for this car is within BMW’s own lineup. You can spec an X5 which has the same drivetrain, much higher quality interior/materials, for $3-4k more which with some discounts really isn’t that much more on a lease (which is how most of these cars leave the lot). Then compare this with the new SQ5 which has been given features from the higher level cars (Air suspension, sound system, acoustic glass, screen options etc). and it looks like BMW are really gambling people will be loyal to the brand.

[Ravenous666]

Originally Posted by Montaver

Agree with a lot of comments here. It’s clearly been cost cut into the ground in terms of materials and design which is disappointing, but I have no doubt it will be very well screwed together. The engineers themselves admitted as much on the cost cutting in the first drive interviews, given the key development decisions were made during the pandemic. It’s a very low effort release from BMW considering it’s their top seller. I think that biggest challenge for this car is within BMW’s own lineup. You can spec an X5 which has the same drivetrain, much higher quality interior/materials, for $3-4k more which with some discounts really isn’t that much more on a lease (which is how most of these cars leave the lot). Then compare this with the new SQ5 which has been given features from the higher level cars (Air suspension, sound system, acoustic glass, screen options etc). and it looks like BMW are really gambling people will be loyal to the brand.

I don't see this low difference in pricing here in Germany.

If I spec a similar X5 40i compared to a X3 M50, the X5 will be €20000,- more than the X3.

[avi66]

Originally Posted by Ravenous666

I don't see this low difference in pricing here in Germany.

If I spec a similar X5 40i compared to a X3 M50, the X5 will be €20000,- more than the X3.

Same here, a decent spec X5 is well over £100k. Although, the X5 has higher quality material and options.