[Never_Enough]

Originally Posted by Red Bread

Automatics? No. I mean, a flight of stairs is really no harder than an escalator, if you can do one you can likely do the other. Thirty years of driving manuals makes for some good muscle memory. Using a clutch and matching revs is really no trickier than looking in a mirror and changing lanes without smashing two cars.

In heavy traffic, our auto 135i had such strong automatic creep and a heavy brake pedal that it was much more work to inch along than my M Coupe, which you could drive with just your left foot in heavy traffic. I'm not saying an automatic is easier or harder, it's a similar, yet different amount of work.

All the I want to drive a manual vs auto bs aside. An auto is obviously easier to drive in traffic. There's no clutch or shifter to worry about. You only play with 2 pedals vs 3 & a shifter.

/discussion

[B58 parts]

Having the manual gearbox is non-negotiable. I'll drive an 80s shitbox before the new M5.

I fight traffic my foot hurts

[Never_Enough]

Originally Posted by YuminNuman

Having the manual gearbox is non-negotiable. I'll drive an 80s shitbox before the new M5.

I fight traffic my foot hurts

Put your $ where your mouth is. Go get an 85 Tercel & sell your BMW.

[B58 parts]

When the day comes that those are my options, I will do that. BMW still gets it, for the time being.

85 Tercel ... with nitrous

[G35POPPEDMYCHERRY]

Ugh Im willing to pay sticker

[Viffermike]

Sheesh. This, again?

Just posted yesterday on a forum related to my current car (I'm a mod for the forum. The other mod has a GT3 RS on order):

I've debated the manual-vs.-auto issue on several forums over the years. I also have a good friend who, as an auto journalist, wrote a piece a couple of years back on the manual being 'dead' that set records on the site it appeared on because it generated so much controversy and discussion. He and I see completely eye-to-eye on this issue: manuals are dying, and for several more reasons than the low 'take rate' on them -- which, I will add, is now about 3.5 percent of all vehicles sold in the U.S., and (IIRC) less than 8 percent in Europe, where they used to be the majority as recently as the 1990s.

I was such a die-hard manual aficionado earlier in life that the one time I bought an SUV (to primarily tow motorcycles) I only considered ones with a manual -- which, at the time, included three models: Jeep Liberty, Jeep Wrangler, and Nissan XTerra. (I went with the Liberty -- which was replaced by a Wrangler after the Liberty was stolen.) I totally understand the connection a manual provides, and until a few years back it was the only choice for anyone serious about driving.

But now, DCTs like the PDK are simply better in nearly all respects if performance, speed, and options are important to you. Run on a track? PDK is quicker. Enjoy canyon carving? PDK enables more precision and attention, easier. Have a bum knee, like me? PDK, all the way.

I find that many who are anti-DCT simply dismiss them because they haven't used one for an extended-enough length of time to appreciate it, much less operate one well. Sound familiar? You know, kind like those who dismiss the Porsche 718/982 because they haven't driven one for an extended-enough length of time to realize that it's just better than a 981 in nearly all respects?

These days, the choice between a manual and a DCT is chiefly one of operational immersion. Do you place the visceral, tactile connection with the car above all other considerations? Then a manual will likely provide more enjoyment for you. Most other 'feelings' connected with owning a performance vehicle, however, are better served with a DCT.

To me, manual-vs. DCT is becoming a similar argument to the convertible-vs.-hardtop proposition because both now have a distinctly romantic component. Is open-top motoring really important to you? Get a 'vert. Otherwise, convertibles are almost always less efficient, less safe, more expensive, more troublesome, etc., etc., etc. Neither a manual or a convertible are practical these days.

That's pretty much it. I respect the hell out of cars like the GT3 since it is keeping the romance of a manually propelled car alive. But bum knee aside, I don't think I'd ever buy a manual again because autos are simply better in every practical and operational way except some subjective measures that I simply don't value as much as some others. Nothing wrong with either view.

[Darth One]

Solution: get a PDK GT3 and a manual GT4

[RM7]

It's not just PDK, even slushboxes are capable of higher performance than a manual these days. The catch is that these take pretty high end PDK and slushbox transmissions to be hands-down better in the performance and driveability arena, but they are there and as time goes on, they further push-out the manual transmissions.

Don't get me wrong, I got my manual 1LE just because it only comes in manual and I wanted to change gears again, but I realize that the fastest way is with some kind of automatic transmission and they have become very smart and capable. When you have to maximize value, IMO this is one of the first things to be compromised, the transmission, either you go to a manual, which will be slower, or the automatic will be cheapened and suck more, being indecisive with gear changes and slow, but when the auto-maker adequately develops their auto, it's no contest as far as quickness.

[10"]

Originally Posted by TSM330i

I said this before when Porsche "stopped" making the manual GT3 because the PDK was quicker around the track - Who cares?
If ultimate lap time is what you want, then chose the PDK. If you want driving nirvana, then chose the manual.

I actually laugh to myself when I'm in stop and go traffic with my manual transmission. I would NEVER trade it for a flappy paddle gearbox. The utter satisfaction I get from a perfect heel-toe downshift makes me so happy. The driver involvement makes it so much better for me. I won't trade it for anything.

That's why my next car will either be an M3 (if it still comes with a manual) or a used 991.2 with a manual.

Exactly! Oh and driving a manual in traffic is easy and I find easier than any dct or auto box...assuming the driver is an experienced manual driver. Never understand that argument...

[FriskyDingo]

Having driven the pre-.2 GT3 cars, I'd really love to give this one a go and see how it compares.

I have to say, I recently drove a 570S, and it had all over any 911 I've driven, flappy paddles and all. And I say that as a massive Porsche fan. The 991.1 GT3 RS comes very close, and the 997.2 GT3 was great, but still.

Would be curious to see if the new manual GT3 could surpass the McLaren for driving enjoyment.

[El Conquistador]

Originally Posted by RABAUKE

I've said it before, why in the name of all things holy does anyone want to drive a flappy paddle?

To appeal to women, there can be no other explanation.

[RABAUKE]

Originally Posted by El Conquistador

To appeal to women, there can be no other explanation.

I guess, my wife drives the stick and hates the auto so maybe many women and many girly men.....