[Montaver]

Originally Posted by avi66

Same here, a decent spec X5 is well over £100k. Although, the X5 has higher quality material and options.

In the US a roughly equivalent spec, looking at $70k for an X3, $75k for an X5. The X5 can be maxed out higher than that though.

[avi66]

Originally Posted by Montaver

In the US a roughly equivalent spec, looking at $70k for an X3, $75k for an X5. The X5 can be maxed out higher than that though.

Looking at BMW UK configurator there is no X5 M40i option. There’s an M60i, a couple of diesels, and a plug in hybrid.

There is an X6 M40i, so I’m not sure if there is an error in the X5 configurator???

[Stockwell]

in Canada, an similar featured X3 M50 C$88K vs X5 40i C$99K.. 12.5% more.. If the main driver is women, need some consideration. My wife is 5'2 and she don't like to climb up that X5!

[Ravenous666]

Originally Posted by Montaver

In the US a roughly equivalent spec, looking at $70k for an X3, $75k for an X5. The X5 can be maxed out higher than that though.

I just compared similar builds on the US webside and comparable X3 M50 was 72250,- while the X5 was 81700,- if both had nearly the same options.

[Montaver]

Originally Posted by Ravenous666

I just compared similar builds on the US webside and comparable X3 M50 was 72250,- while the X5 was 81700,- if both had nearly the same options.

Not sure what you are speccing on the X5 to get it that high. Equally specced an X3 is $70,125 and the X5 is $76,875. The X5 has been around for a while and you will easily get a bigger discount. On a lease payment the difference will be $100, if that.

https://www.bmwusa.com/build-your-ow...680kl8/summary


https://www.bmwusa.com/build-your-ow...6wxe8r/summary

[BobBMWX3]

I am not sold on this whole "cost cutting" story that keeps being mentioned. BMW has made engineering changes to a great engine, squeezing another 15 HP out of it. Added cost. They added the spare back. Added cost. They sourced environmentally friendly materials. Added cost.

What we are seeing with X3 is design decisions that favor a different look. Certain people are equating this new look with less quality. Only time will tell if these parts are of quality or not.

While I am sure that BMW is working hard to optimize their costs, especially given the economic changes over the past couple of years, they are also trying to provide a genuine X3.

[TurtleBoy]

Originally Posted by BobBMWX3

I am not sold on this whole "cost cutting" story that keeps being mentioned. BMW has made engineering changes to a great engine, squeezing another 15 HP out of it. Added cost. They added the spare back. Added cost. They sourced environmentally friendly materials. Added cost.

What we are seeing with X3 is design decisions that favor a different look. Certain people are equating this new look with less quality. Only time will tell if these parts are of quality or not.

While I am sure that BMW is working hard to optimize their costs, especially given the economic changes over the past couple of years, they are also trying to provide a genuine X3.

I have not been in the G45 but if you look at recent LCI and new generations you will certainly see evidence of much lower quality materials as well as missing standard features. I guess the G45 could be different but from what we have seen so far that doesn't seem to be the case.

[blackpear]

Originally Posted by BobBMWX3

I am not sold on this whole "cost cutting" story that keeps being mentioned. BMW has made engineering changes to a great engine, squeezing another 15 HP out of it. Added cost. They added the spare back. Added cost. They sourced environmentally friendly materials. Added cost.

What we are seeing with X3 is design decisions that favor a different look. Certain people are equating this new look with less quality. Only time will tell if these parts are of quality or not.

While I am sure that BMW is working hard to optimize their costs, especially given the economic changes over the past couple of years, they are also trying to provide a genuine X3.

You make some good points especially that the design decisions favour a different look. I agree but still see elements that appear cheaper, maybe I mean less premium looking.

I can live with the external looks, BMW call it monolithic. I find the lack of curves and creases make the vehicle rather too bland but it’s not horrendous.

I have more problems with the inside. They have done away with knobs and buttons , it’s all on the screen. I can live with that.

The Christmas lights are overdone, this is no longer subtle ambient lighting and is now a key feature, maybe the key feature along with the screen.

Whether it be the knitted dashboard or the plain one, they are a plain sea of plastic with with no eye appeal. Exactly the same with the doors.

Metal has almost completely gone from the cabin. Previously it was used tastefully and had a lot to do with the premium feel. Look at the current X3 and X5.

The designers have gone for the minimalist approach. I preferred the tasteful application of metal, double stitching, subtle adornments, the leather. I could immediately see the little details and notice the aesthetic care that went into the design.

But it’s only my opinion.

[Sportstick]

Originally Posted by TurtleBoy

I have not been in the G45 but if you look at recent LCI and new generations you will certainly see evidence of much lower quality materials as well as missing standard features. I guess the G45 could be different but from what we have seen so far that doesn't seem to be the case.

I have seen lower cost materials, but I haven't found anything of lower quality when I scan the models in the showroom during service visits. Everything seems to fit well and have consistent surfaces. The interiors just don't feel as upscale as before.

[Montaver]

Originally Posted by BobBMWX3

I am not sold on this whole "cost cutting" story that keeps being mentioned. BMW has made engineering changes to a great engine, squeezing another 15 HP out of it. Added cost. They added the spare back. Added cost. They sourced environmentally friendly materials. Added cost.

What we are seeing with X3 is design decisions that favor a different look. Certain people are equating this new look with less quality. Only time will tell if these parts are of quality or not.

While I am sure that BMW is working hard to optimize their costs, especially given the economic changes over the past couple of years, they are also trying to provide a genuine X3.

The engine is effectively the gen3/TU2 B58 which will ultimately be in a number of models. All the changes are effectively focused on efficiency for emissions tests. BMW are moving away from run flats, again for fuel economy, as standard tires have can have a lower rolling resistance. They have made some advances in synthetic materials I.e seat surfaces etc. recycled materials again is driven by EU targets.

The wider story that’s affecting the entire industry is the push to electric cars is a huge capital drain, in 2019 BMW announced they would reduce production costs by 25pc per car. Hence why we have no physical controls for example, and every BMW seemingly has the same screen.

It doesn’t mean they are not trying to build a good car, but there is no hiding it’s a lower effort release that doesn’t move the ball forward from a luxury perspective which is what was originally rumoured. The moonroof doesn’t open for example (I wouldn’t spec one anyway given the choice), they didn’t fix the sound system to include proper low range speakers in the doors (we know they can do it, look at the i4), cheaper interior materials (although the announced Chinese versions look more premium and have metal door handles for example). I’m sure it will drive very nicely, but on the face of it what is it doing better than the previous gen? It’s the same CLAR architecture etc. that’s ultimately where the disappointment is, but we shall see when reviews are out. As someone who had this earmarked to replace my M340i lease I’m saying all this as a genuine buyer, but what I’ve seen so far the jury is definitely out.

[BigMonkeyWrench]

Originally Posted by BobBMWX3

I am not sold on this whole "cost cutting" story that keeps being mentioned. BMW has made engineering changes to a great engine, squeezing another 15 HP out of it. Added cost.

Not necessarily. The engines have always produced more power than advertised. They could simply raise the published power level without doing anything.

They added the spare back. Added cost.

Perhaps. But maybe they get better deals with non-RF than RF tires. Or they can use softer (ie thinner) springs, weaker struts, thinner control arms, etc. to deal with having less mass of wheel/tire combo, etc. We have to look at the whole system and not just piece parts.

What I will say is a cost-cutting fact is removing buttons. It's obviously cheaper to move the controls to a touch screen that is already there vs having physical buttons, the wiring and connectors that go with the buttons and the warranty repairs that can come with having physical buttons. This is done under the guise of "modernization". I can't think of one person that prefers having buttons moved to the screen. It's an anti-consumer move.

[MdW86]

The plastic door handles (inside) are probably a big cost saver too, but also a part of the car that you experience every single drive.

[wartnig]

Originally Posted by MdW86

The plastic door handles (inside) are probably a big cost saver too, but also a part of the car that you experience every single drive.

My current x3 also has plastic door handles inside.

[avi66]

Originally Posted by Stephenkward

My current x3 also has plastic door handles inside.

Really cheap looking big black plastic with sharp points ?

My G01 LCI has a kinda satin aluminium looking finish/feel slim pull handle that matches the aluminium looking door, dash, console and vent trim etc. It’s constant across the car, and whilst some/all of it may be plastic, it’s not particularly cheap looking black plastic like the G45 at GFS.

There is no defence or excuse for the material choice in the G45. It’s hard to fathom how they managed to make it look so cheap.

[srekal34]

Interior door handles on g01 lci are definitely NOT plastic. They are cold to touch, whereas the ones in g60 are warm to touch plastic. Probably will be the same on g45

[blackpear]

Originally Posted by srekal34

Interior door handles on g01 lci are definitely NOT plastic. They are cold to touch, whereas the ones in g60 are warm to touch plastic. Probably will be the same on g45

It’s plastic, but it’s quality plastic that is engineered nicely and fits well. No one will notice.

I think they did some downgrades on the G60, then thought - well, we have got away with that - so pushed the envelope further with the G45.

Maybe that’s one of the design principles.

[BMW Lease Deals]

All I can say is that I know I've voiced my opinion about not liking the new X3 personally, but I think it's resonating with buyers in general. I've only gotten a handful of requests for a 2025 X3 xDr30i or an M50, and I haven't sold any of them.

That being said, dealerships received far fewer allocations for xDr30is, and those have mostly sold, but there are a lot of M50s available. We have to see what happens when the 2024s are gone, though.

[EWL5]

Originally Posted by Stephenkward

My current x3 also has plastic door handles inside.

You have a bar to help with closing the door. I think the G45 is missing this bar!

[wartnig]

Originally Posted by EWL5

You have a bar to help with closing the door. I think the G45 is missing this bar!

You’re right. This is now integrated into the arm rest on the door in the G45

[avi66]

Originally Posted by Stephenkward

You’re right. This is now integrated into the arm rest on the door in the G45

But the finish is piano black in that area, and it’s not really ideal as door pull due to the reach required to use it. A reviewer also commented that the area will scratch up quickly due to the use of piano black in a high interaction area.

Using the black plastic door open handle appears to be the door pull now.

Around the 20 min mark -

[avi66]

Re cost cutting -

“ It isn’t that it’s a badly engineered car — not a bit of it — but the materials used in the interior are below par to say the least, and BMW knows it. In a refreshing wave of honesty, some executives quietly admitted to Driving.co.uk that the quality isn’t what they might have wished for, thanks almost entirely to the firm’s bean-counters.”


“ From the Sunday Times UK

Sounds good, doesn’t it? But then you slip into the driving seat, and it all goes sideways very quickly. Getting in is fine, and the sportily sculpted seats are perfectly pleasant, even with the sustainable fabric that feels a bit rough but is otherwise comfortable. You’re greeted by a cleanly designed and minimalist new dashboard that’s topped with a massive screen housing, and there’s lots of ambient lighting all over the place. And then you close the door…
At that point, things start to unravel, because the handle built into the arm rest feels terribly cheap. The sort of cheapness we kind of accepted in the Volkswagen Up! a decade ago, but certainly won’t tolerate in a premium SUV today. And once your hand has recoiled from the tackiness in the manner of a 21st Century Jack Sparrow picking up dog dirt, you realise most of the door card feels equally low-rent. The arm rest itself is fine, but the plastic on the top of the door is no better than acceptable, and the door catch is dire. It’s thin and lightweight, the texture is naff and the whole thing feels like it’s made from old wheelie bins. It even makes the same noise as a wheelie bin lid closing when you let it spring back into place.

Were that the end of the X3’s interior woes, we might let it off and view the whole thing as an oversight that will be fixed at the next update, but the problems run deeper than that. There’s a strange multi-function switch panel next to the door catch that feels just as cheap and insecure, while the plastic panel on the lower part of the dashboard is tacky and unpleasant. So too are the shift paddles behind the steering wheel and the air vent controls, which feel lightweight and fiddly. Oh, and the glovebox is crummy, too.”

https://www.driving.co.uk/car-review...3-2024-review/

[hans007]

I think theres definitely a little cost cutting. The door handle thing especially bothers me.


Its funny , my mom has an E83 x3..... and that was I remember very criticized for cost cutting and unpainted wheel arches, so the X3 is really just back to itself from 20 years ago. The e83... also had plastic door handles!

I suppose though to hit a price point they have to do something. Its got to be price competitive with say audi...

Audi's new Q5/SQ5 in the US, doesn't look liek they cut anything. Oh but wait, they completely removed the 48V hybrid system from US models. It only is a difference of 5 mpg. So I guess ultimately BMW just had a budget and they spent it elsewhere.