[Artemis]

Originally Posted by m3number86

Yep….also looks like a rapper name lol

Trust me: U Can't Touch This.

[m3number86]

Originally Posted by Artemis

Trust me: U Can't Touch This.

Attachment 2942039

Too Legit! 2 quit! Lol

[CoopersF15]

Originally Posted by swampfox94

Really excited for all the people who begged bmw for an m wagon to put their money where their mouth is lol

I begged for the M3 Wagon. It's in my price range. I'd settle for M340i wagon at this point.

I can't afford the M5 Wagon so can't put my money where my mouth is until the used market in 5 years when a well abused version might start to dip into reality - and the OEM doesn't care about the used market sales. So they cancel future wagons in these shores.

And so continues this dumb cycle of wagons not being sold in the US.

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by m3number86

Too Legit! 2 quit! Lol

The Man, the Myth, the Legend. Respect him.

[xlover]

Originally Posted by mbanck

I don't think BMW ever said exactly why it was not viable to bring the G81 (M3 touring) stateside.

But one big factor AIUI was that the battery in the luggage compartment was not separated from the passenger compartment (in the touring, not the sedan/coupe), violating US-specific safety regulations. I'm not a G3x specialist, but a quick search seems to imply this was also the case for the G31 (current 5er touring).

So it could be that BMW decided to relocate the G61 and/or G99 battery to the front (and due to the hybrid battery likely being behind the driver/under the back seats, it could work from a weight distribution point of view), thus dodging this bullet. The federalization costs might mean the G99 is considerably (but not prohibitively) more expense than the G90 sedan and so the business case is still there for a limited edition (which then might not need federalization at all, not sure), we'll see...

This is pretty close to the situation for the M3 wagon as I read it. Insiders commented quite a bit on the early threads about the wagon: beyond the certification hurdle, because the G21 was never designed with any us market model in mind (bmw itself has stated the m3 wagon was a late proposal), the car would need a significant redesign to even meet us regs… then testing after that

I imagine after the reaction to the M3 wagon or probably even just some better platform design synergies new 5 wagon will at least be regulatory compliant to start.

I don't really know anything about how the testing works but one hypothesis I had was that because of the single platform to support a BEV, hybrid, and ice variants there might be more general design commonality between wagon and sedan where less specific testing is necessary making this low volume variant profitable or at least ROI neutral especially when the marketing aspect is factored in (the m3 wagon has gotten a ton of chatter going on it's own despite being ultra low volume)

[BimmerMat135]

Originally Posted by CoopersF15

I begged for the M3 Wagon. It's in my price range. I'd settle for M340i wagon at this point.

I can't afford the M5 Wagon so can't put my money where my mouth is until the used market in 5 years when a well abused version might start to dip into reality - and the OEM doesn't care about the used market sales. So they cancel future wagons in these shores.

And so continues this dumb cycle of wagons not being sold in the US.

I'm with you one that one it's seem like this forum is filled with representative of the 0.5%. The M3 wagon would have been a perfect fit for me. I never had a loan on any of my car so I will end up saving longer to get the M5 Touring but still i would have prefer a cheaper alternative.

The golf sportwagon did sell like hot cake in my area but not in USA so they kill it. Now they are brigning 100K+ wagon and they will complain later : You see we told you wagon don't sell good.

[Capt Canuck]

LOLs at folks having no problem dropping ~$90k on a car complaining about one in the $100ks 😆

Darn that nth of the 1%, if only they knew how tough it was for the rest of us in the 3/4s of that 1%.
It's no 330i, no one is going to peg estate car popularity on such a niche option.

[Equilibrandt]

Here in Cali, I've seen about 5x as many Audi RS6 wagons as I have A6 and A4 wagons combined.

Gotta wonder if the super expensive estate/wagon market is more profitable than the base model wagon market for some invisible reason.

Sell less (but more expensive) niche cars.

[NGT2]

Originally Posted by Equilibrandt

Here in Cali, I've seen about 5x as many Audi RS6 wagons as I have A6 and A4 wagons combined.

Gotta wonder if the super expensive estate/wagon market is more profitable than the base model wagon market for some invisible reason.

Sell less (but more expensive) niche cars.

I saw one down south the other day at the golf course. It was impressive.

[Remonster]

Originally Posted by TheBingoBalls

This is why I can never believe the excuses or explanations of why car x or car y won't make it to a certain market. All we've been hearing every time a model doesn't get introduced to a certain market is cost, too expensive to do this or that and ultimately didn't make sense to bring it. And is the Touring coming back? If not, then bringing the M5 Touring goes even more against this.

But let's bring a wagon that is a M car and will likely be priced over $100k because a car with any of those are such high sellers on their own.

I'm glad that something relatively unique is coming but cheesed that we can't get other desirable units that would likely sell more than a high performance wagon (looking at you RS6) because it costs too much to develop and they won't recoup the cost.

The G20 3 series was already in production with a wagon bodystyle that does not meet certain US regulations when they decided to make a G81 M3. At that point, it was too late / too expensive to make this vehicle US road legal. I believe the location of the battery is a big part of the problem and that isn't easy to relocate.

The next 5 series is not here yet, it's possible and likely that the strong (relative) sales of RS6 and E63 wagons in the US plus the strong outcry from people wanting to buy a G81 M3 here convinced BMW to make sure the next gen 5 series touring was US legal and that allows for a simpler and more affordable addition of an M5 touring for the US market.

I think it was the wrong choice out of the two possibilities but could still be a cool and somewhat popular vehicle here. The G81 M3 touring in the US has no direct competitor and would be massively more affordable than the RS6 and E63 in the next size / price bracket. That would likely sell very well. It's size and price fit into a very popular enthusiast market. On the other hand, M5 touring has to compete with the Audi and AMG for a share of a smaller, less affordable market.

If they had realized F31 sold poorly here because it was priced idiotically high and only available in the lamest 4 cylinder configs, they could have brought a more appealing G21 lineup here in non-M form and also allowed for a US spec G81 M3.

[Doctor///M]

Originally Posted by duky

Holy crapola!! Give me it now. Anything to get out of Audi MMI. I love the RS6 but I would also love to get back into the BMW family

How is the RS6? I just came back from a family vacation and spent a week with an A6 touring. Loved the experience, actually but probably more had to do with driving across Europe after a 3-year hiatus.

[m3welt]

Sign me the F up

[M3 boi]

Originally Posted by ynguldyn

US version of G99 M5 Touring is confirmed.

I can't wait to see one blast off in front of my mom who thinks station Wagens are boring lol

[duky]

Originally Posted by Doctor///M

How is the RS6? I just came back from a family vacation and spent a week with an A6 touring. Loved the experience, actually but probably more had to do with driving across Europe after a 3-year hiatus.

Just so so good. It's nowhere near as engaging/raw as an M5 and it made me realize I think the RS6 is made not to be "the only car" for a driving enthusiast but one of a few cars for a driving enthusiast. The only reason I'd want a more comfortable car than this is either ground clearance (SUV) for outdoor excursions, pickup bed for loading, or Uber luxury like rolls/bentley etc. This to me is the perfect car for a small family with a driving enthusiast who can also afford to have a true driver's car next to it but wants to also enjoy the driving experience when going to work or on a road trip. It's a fantastic car. But if I only had space for one car in my life I'd have to get something that tips a bit farther towards the side of focusing on driving dynamics even if sacrificing comfort/noise isolation.

[M-technik-3]

Happened to see and hear an RS6 at my last Lemons race in Thompson CT. Makes a great engine note. Out of my budget just like the MB and the M5. At some point I may put an N54 in my e91. It has no real realistic value so modified one would never be anything more.

[note46]

I'm #1 on the verbal list with the dealership. I spoke to the manager and the GM. It will get converted to a written #1 on the list once BMW officially announces that G99 is coming to the US. FWIW I also have a 15' 328d wagon and was really hoping the M3 wagon also make it to the US. I can settle for the G99

[jphcbpa]

More room for high performance: BMW M GmbH confirms development of a new BMW M5 Touring.

https://www.press.bmwgroup.com/globa...ng?language=en

[Quadruple VANOS]

Originally Posted by OSee

Maybe if the Wagon audience tries really really hard to get Americans to use "Touring" you might change folks minds. I mean...just look how far the Convertible guys are getting with 'Vert'

I keep hearing the term “long roof.” Anything but station wagon I guess. 😂

[shawnhayes]

Originally Posted by Quadruple VANOS

I keep hearing the term “long roof.” Anything but station wagon I guess. 😂

WTF is wrong with people? They'll take an 8000lb SUV that's HUGE and way too much for their needs, but not buy a "touring" because it's too big?

WHY?

Shawn

(personally, my family has an X5e because it's the only suitable cargo area in a BMW plug in 40 mile range hybrid because Americans won't buy a M package 540e touring and as such BMW won't bring it. dammit)

[NGT2]

Originally Posted by shawnhayes

WTF is wrong with people? They'll take an 8000lb SUV that's HUGE and way too much for their needs, but not buy a "touring" because it's too big?

WHY?

Shawn

(personally, my family has an X5e because it's the only suitable cargo area in a BMW plug in 40 mile range hybrid because Americans won't buy a M package 540e touring and as such BMW won't bring it. dammit)

I think a 540 touring would do well. I’m in a smaller market and I see a decent number of E series wagons, even though they have to be ordered and dealers don’t just get them in inventory. I wouldn’t trade my M550 for one, but if I went back to a 540 then I’d pick a wagon if available.

Edit to add - I don’t think they keep them out of the US because we won’t buy them. They could even do what Benz does and offer it as available to order. I think they don’t want to cut into their own X vehicle sales.

[oem.plus_440gc]

Originally Posted by NGT2

I think a 540 touring would do well. I’m in a smaller market and I see a decent number of E series wagons, even though they have to be ordered and dealers don’t just get them in inventory. I wouldn’t trade my M550 for one, but if I went back to a 540 then I’d pick a wagon if available.

Edit to add - I don’t think they keep them out of the US because we won’t buy them. They could even do what Benz does and offer it as available to order. I think they don’t want to cut into their own X vehicle sales.

I always hear that as an explanation for a car company not producing/bringing a car to a certain market. But in reality offering both just guarantees the $$ stays with BMW, vs someone who really wants a touring buying a MB or Audi rather than a BMW. Make sure the margins on the X and Tourings are the same, and BMW wins either way. Removing tourings from the option leaves a whole for another manufacturer to fill.

[NGT2]

Originally Posted by oem.plus_440gc

I always hear that as an explanation for a car company not producing/bringing a car to a certain market. But in reality offering both just guarantees the $$ stays with BMW, vs someone who really wants a touring buying a MB or Audi rather than a BMW. Make sure the margins on the X and Tourings are the same, and BMW wins either way. Removing tourings from the option leaves a whole for another manufacturer to fill.

I 100% agree but that’s the only explanation that makes sense. It’s lazy but these decisions are made by humans and humans can be lazy. Maybe they don’t want to do the math on expected demand and production for each and just say “screw it, they’ll buy an X”. Also, they make the X here. The wagon would be imported, so the margin probably isn’t the same with reasonable pricing.

I’d just make the wagon available to order and let it cost what it costs. I wouldn’t load up dealer lots with them or advertise them hard. Benz never advertises the E wagon. People that want one will go looking. It’s a niche, I just think it’s a profitable one. Volvo makes a great looking wagon but it’s boring to drive. Why not come and blow them up a little with a 540 wagon that has some attitude?