[memento]

NOT looking for anything official here. I'm providing moral support to my sister in her divorce from an abusive drug user. She is in county court trying to get through the divorce. The county judge retired and they have a rotating judge right now, who is from a different county. This judge has suddenly decided that, even after a year, my sister should NOT be receiving spousal support along with child support. I am told that the law in her county is that she is entitled to spousal support, even if she decides to sit at home on her ass (she has 2 jobs though).

My question is simple. How can a judge send a letter to her lawyer denying her support payments that she is legally entitled to? And what does she have to do now? Appeal? That is what HER lawyer says, but she's already $25k into all of this, so I'm just looking for a reality check.

[Zephyr15]

In most states you have the opportunity to ask the judge to reconsider his decision. If your sister is clearly entitled to those benefits under the law its a way to point it out the judge, respectfully, that he missed something rather obvious. If that fails, all she can do is appeal.

She should investigate to see if she qualifies for free or reduced cost legal services. There may be local legal clinics (could be sponsored by local bar associations, law schools, whatever) that represent women in family law cases, or some other option available to her.

[335R1]

APPEAL. That judge is effed up.

[memento]

so basically the judge can say whatever the heck he wants, then it's up to the lawyer to appeal their decision? that's how I see it, at least. This temporary judge has been very bipolar all along. It sounds he's finally fed up with dealing with the case and said this to get it out of his hair, knowing they would appeal and he wouldn't have to deal with it any more.

[solefald]

Originally Posted by memento

so basically the judge can say whatever the heck he wants, then it's up to the lawyer to appeal their decision?

pretty much so. but the thing is that a divorce lawyer will not appeal shit... i have never ever heard about appeals on a family cases (there have been, but i havent heard of a single one)

my divorce lawyer ended up being a complete rip-off. he did not do *anything* for me other than filing my papers. he sent his assistant to court with me and the assistant hasn't opened his mouth at all. not once. its like he was not even there.

so the judge made me pay child support, spousal support (because she apparently got used to "certain life-style" not sure what that meant, since our "lifestyle" was living paycheck to paycheck and barely making rent because she did not work or bring any money) and on top of that i ended up having to pay for *HER FUCKING LAWYER TOO* because i was the one who filed for divorce, which apparently made her hire an attorney (her parents paid for him, but that didn't count, so i got stuck with the bill).

There is no such thing as "fair" in a divorce court. Especially not in CA.

And my "lawyer" sent me a bunch of bills that not even my friends who went to law school were able to de-cipher, except for one charge.

I got charged $240 to receive a 17 second long voicemail from his secretary which said: "Oops, i am faxing your something, but accidentally dialed your cell phone instead of fax number. Bye" They charge by the hour and don't round down, so in his eyes 17 seconds = 1 hour of hard lawyer work, so $240 for that was justified.

[Spec 1]

He's a judge, therefore he IS the law. Completely dumb? Sure.

Why is your friend wanting child AND spousal support??? Especially if she has 2 jobs. Sounds like she's trying to rob the ex hubby.

[number335]

Originally Posted by solefald

pretty much so. but the thing is that a divorce lawyer will not appeal shit... i have never ever heard about appeals on a family cases (there have been, but i havent heard of a single one)

my divorce lawyer ended up being a complete rip-off. he did not do *anything* for me other than filing my papers. he sent his assistant to court with me and the assistant hasn't opened his mouth at all. not once. its like he was not even there.

so the judge made me pay child support, spousal support (because she apparently got used to "certain life-style" not sure what that meant, since our "lifestyle" was living paycheck to paycheck and barely making rent because she did not work or bring any money) and on top of that i ended up having to pay for *HER FUCKING LAWYER TOO* because i was the one who filed for divorce, which apparently made her hire an attorney (her parents paid for him, but that didn't count, so i got stuck with the bill).

There is no such thing as "fair" in a divorce court. Especially not in CA.

And my "lawyer" sent me a bunch of bills that not even my friends who went to law school were able to de-cipher, except for one charge.

I got charged $240 to receive a 17 second long voicemail from his secretary which said: "Oops, i am faxing your something, but accidentally dialed your cell phone instead of fax number. Bye" They charge by the hour and don't round down, so in his eyes 17 seconds = 1 hour of hard lawyer work, so $240 for that was justified.

that's some fuct up shat man!

[solefald]

Originally Posted by Spec 1

Why is your friend wanting child AND spousal support??? Especially if she has 2 jobs. Sounds like she's trying to rob the ex hubby.

Not sure about other states, but in CA you end up paying both, regardless if how many jobs the wife has.

Spousal support is usually paid half the length of the length of marriage.
I was married for 14 mo, so i had to pay 7 month of it.

When you add child support, spousal support and payments to my ex's lawyer and then have it garnished directly from my paycheck, I brought home 25% of my salary, but still had to pay taxes on the other 75%. This killed my credit since i could not even dream about paying my credit card bills and had to voluntary surrender a leased car, which put a repossession on my history.

That was 8+ years ago, yet I am still trying to fix my credit...

[Hawkeye]

damn, divorces are no joke. You could have just knocked her off... on accident of course. Those sticky accellerators...

[Spec 1]

Originally Posted by solefald

Not sure about other states, but in CA you end up paying both, regardless if how many jobs the wife has.

Spousal support is usually paid half the length of the length of marriage.
I was married for 14 mo, so i had to pay 7 month of it.

When you add child support, spousal support and payments to my ex's lawyer and then have it garnished directly from my paycheck, I brought home 25% of my salary, but still had to pay taxes on the other 75%. This killed my credit since i could not even dream about paying my credit card bills and had to voluntary surrender a leased car, which put a repossession on my history.

That was 8+ years ago, yet I am still trying to fix my credit...

Holy moly. Chalk another thing on the board for "Don't marry that bitch".
I don't understand why the woman would get spousal support on top of it... shouldn't you be able to get it back from her then? I mean, you were her spouse too...

[Maestro]

Have to agree, a judge can do what he wants, the mistake most people do walking into court is to think the judge is going to watch out for their rights and make sure the other side does not trample on their rights....

That is completely wrong, the Judge could care less, he only makes decisions if the other side objects. If you do not stand up for your rights the judge assumes you are doing so knowingly.

The only thing that keeps a judge form doing everything he likes is the fear his decisions get over turned on appeal and he is looking for a high position in the court system. Judges will not get a higher position of appointment if he has a track record of being over turned or making poor decision.

Every once in a while you run into a Judge on a power trip who is out to proved he can do what he likes to people in his court.

[Peanuto]

A little off topic, but was watching a case (my father is a lawyer) that ended up awarding a 34 million dollar verdict. The judge kept having to ask people to repeat things because he was on a laptop (i later found out researching vacations) during the middle of trial. Judges don't always pay attention and or know the law.

[number335]

this is why men in japan are marrying pillows.

[solefald]

Originally Posted by Spec 1

Holy moly. Chalk another thing on the board for "Don't marry that bitch".
I don't understand why the woman would get spousal support on top of it... shouldn't you be able to get it back from her then? I mean, you were her spouse too...

Spousal support depends squarely on the income and who makes more. A wife can chose not to request any. Most of the time its her lawyers suggestion to make outcome of the case more "positive" for her, disregarding the fact that not everyone can afford paying it. In my case I was the one with the job, so I ended up paying, even though I filed for divorce because she was openly cheating on me. CA has a "no fault" law, so the reasons for divorce are not taked into consideration at all. Talk about kicking someone when thy're down. That being said, if your wife makes more money then you do, nothing stops you from requesting (and getting) spousal support.

And the funny thing is that i had 0 intentions of getting married, even after our kid was born, but my parents came to visit and after a week of daily "when-are-you-gonna-get-married-when-are-you-gonna-get-married-when-are-you-gonna-get-married?" i got pissed off and we got married. On a Tuesday. After work. Worst $50 i have ever spent.



Q: Why are divorces so expensive?
A: Because they are totally worth it!

[Kroy]

Originally Posted by number335

this is why men in korea are marrying pillows.

fixed. but wouldn't surprise me if it happened in japan too.

Originally Posted by solefald

Spousal support depends squarely on the income and who makes more. A wife can chose not to request any. Most of the time its her lawyers suggestion to make outcome of the case more "positive" for her, disregarding the fact that not everyone can afford paying it. In my case I was the one with the job, so I ended up paying, even though I filed for divorce because she was openly cheating on me. CA has a "no fault" law, so the reasons for divorce are not taked into consideration at all. Talk about kicking someone when thy're down. That being said, if your wife makes more money then you do, nothing stops you from requesting (and getting) spousal support.

And the funny thing is that i had 0 intentions of getting married, even after our kid was born, but my parents came to visit and after a week of daily "when-are-you-gonna-get-married-when-are-you-gonna-get-married-when-are-you-gonna-get-married?" i got pissed off and we got married. On a Tuesday. After work. Worst $50 i have ever spent.



Q: Why are divorces so expensive?
A: Because they are totally worth it!

hope your parents never questioned you again. well, if they did, i'd pull this ish up on the last time you took their advice.

Originally Posted by Hawkeye

damn, divorces are no joke. You could have just knocked her off... on accident of course. Those sticky accellerators...

shoulda bought her a toyota.

[memento]

Yes, here in NY he is required to pay spousal support, too. I have heard horror stories about divorce lawyers not doing their job. We are fortunate in that her lawyer is personally involved in everything and is a little spitfire. My sister's ex is a violent and angry person who intimidates everyone, except the lawyer. He tried yelling and screaming at her (the lawyer) during a deposition and she, at like 5'1", stood right up to him and yelled him down. Right in front of HIS lawyer, who did nothing.

We just want what my sister is legally allowed and get this over with. They will appeal, it just sucks that a judge can do that at will.

I didn't say that she had high paying jobs. just making the point that she IS trying by working and not sitting on her ass collecting as much money as possible while doing as little as possible.

thanks for the feedback and discussion.

[Maestro]

Sounds like your sister might have a good lawyer... But they do screw up sometimes.

A buddy of mine own a business which we started after getting married. It was not going well, most everything he made went back into the business.

As you can expect the wife got feed up that he stopped spending money on her and told him she wanted a divorce, he agree and asked that they not include lawyers, he agree to continue making her car payments and insurance payments until it was paid off and told her she can have anything in the apartment above the business they owned, as long as she agreed to sign over and rights she had to the business since she was not at all involved in it. She agreed.

Well her stupid sister told her she was nuts, and she needed a lawyer and my friend was screwing her over. So the lawyer got involved told my friend he was going to take him for everything he had plus then some.

The stupid lawyer never check anything out and did not realize the only thing my friend had was debt. So they show up in front of the judge my friend without a lawyer, the wife and her idiot lawyer. First the judge told my friend he needs a lawyer and my friend said he could not afford one then then the judge told him he was an idiot for representing himself.

They proceed and the lawyer gets to go first and gives the whole story how she game my friend the best 2 yrs of her life and how he broke all kinds of promises to her and such and that she deserved to have spousal support and half of the business and the lists goes on.

The lawyer finishes up and the judge look at my friend as said what do you have to say. My friend tell the judge of the original agreement, and that car was bought by her prior to the marriage when she was working. The building which the business was in was bought by him prior to the marriage and yes the business was started after the marriage and the wife was suppose to work in the business and decide it was below her and she just wanted to be kept, which he was okay with.

Then he dropped the Bomb shell on them all, he said the the loan on the building was $350K and the business was presently in debt for $50K and said if he has to pay support and give her half the business which he would agree to but she had to come up with either money to pay for half the debt or would just shut it all down and file for bankruptcy and put her in the whole with him.

Needless to say, the judge ripped the lawyer a new one and said that the original agreement was more than fair and did not represent his client properly.

The Judge said she can have only what she brought to the apartment, anything they bought after getting married which was not part of the business. If she wanted income from the business she would be liable for half the debt. She could keep her car but my friend did not have to make payments on it and she was responsible for her own insurance.

Needless to say my friend actually came out ahead on this one. When the business did finally start turning a real profit a few years later he did send her a check since he felt bad the lawyer screwed her over.