[JCZ5]

Originally Posted by TheBingoBalls

You are 100% correct. This would be ok IF that's where it ends. I'm not talking about you specifically but people who do this, do you think they stop there? Getting to that $50 difference was only part one to weed out most dealerships. Now it's how to get that $50 off in monthly payment to $75. $100. I'm sure this is the same in every state that has multiple BMW dealerships. The auto industry is a very small place in that everyone knows everyone. While multiple BMW dealerships compete against each other, you also have friends that work in those different dealerships that talk to each other.

As I said earlier, the problem isn't looking for a deal, but we've got to a point where you're cross shopping for dollars to pennies in monthly payments. That is what BMWCCA1 was referring to.

That's helpful. And yeah leasing is a black hole with some many avenues for negotiations. I'm not patient enough to take part in that and would rather buy and hold a car long-term. After all, love those classic BMWs with ownership stories on petrolicious

[white2abbit]

Originally Posted by fanekstudio

Just a crazy idea, can we do a petition/letter to BMW asking them not to do this or give us at least a last chance?

Lets show BMW there are so many of us that are still interested in ED!

Saying now that they will grant it for orders until May 18 is giving no last change considering the current COVID lockdowns.

What about extension until next spring and if NA doesn't show a greater number of 500 orders than they were right to shut it down.

Let just ask for a final small window of opportunity!
Who is in?

Let's do it! I'll sign!

[TheBingoBalls]

Originally Posted by JCZ5

That's helpful. And yeah leasing is a black hole with some many avenues for negotiations. I'm not patient enough to take part in that and would rather buy and hold a car long-term. After all, love those classic BMWs with ownership stories on petrolicious

Neither am I. I know 7% is your markup. I'll take 6% and give you about $1,000 on your vehicle gross to sign this deal. I'm not going to fight over that last 1% because someone else got 6.5%.

[Dimitri]

So glad I was able to experience it, it's an awesome way to pick a new car, such a great experience. Was hoping to do it again

[keylime503]

Originally Posted by TheBingoBalls

Because you really don't know everything about that car - as much you think every car is the same, they're not. You might be shopping between two M4's that are spec'd the same but one dealer is giving a huge discount. What you don't know is that the dealer that is giving you a discount had to buy that car from BMW for a promo in exchange for a huge discount.

There are various ways dealerships can receive cars outside of their required order banks and they may or may not have significant cost savings that they can pass on to their customers.

Going back to your first sentence, it's not that you're aren't privy to an amazing deal, you were just not there at the right place and time.

I'm talking about placing a factory order for the exact same spec on the exact same day. Why is one dealer giving a huge discount relative to the other one? Why did one dealer have to "buy" that car from BMW for a promo? Why are there various ways dealerships can receive cars outside of their required order banks?

I'm sorry but you're just proving my point. The convoluted smoke and mirrors of middleman dealerships that compete against each other is the root of this problem. If dealerships were simply sales offices for the manufacturer who are required to sell each car at exactly the price you see on the manufacturer's website, all of this goes away.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by CosmosMpower

Different kind of cars. Porsche doesn't make a fun small/medium size sedan like a M3. Your only choices are a 2+2 coupe 911 or a giant ugly Panamera or a SUV.

Agreed, which is why it always baffles me when somebody tosses Porsche into the mix.

[2000Z3M]

wow. and yet this is another push for me to move to porsche.

[VBM2]

So sad at this. I did ED in 2018 for my LBB M2 and it was an amazing journey with my family. 5 countries, mountain passes and Nürburgring. For those who want to do ED with Porsche, (which I want someday), good luck. My reading/research says the dealer has to pay $3000 for you to do ED. They charge you to pick it up in Atlanta if you want the PCD experience. And as my wife says, Volvo's and Mercedes are for old people.

[adc]

I was lucky enough (prescient?) to do 6 Euro Deliveries, at both the Freimann center and the Welt. All memorable, incredible experiences and amazing car bonding opportunities.

But on the last one in 2018, my CA told me it’s on its last legs, and BMW will soon cancel it. So I’m not surprised.

But I am sad. I would have done a few more probably.



My problem today is that I doubt I can put an order for an M2CS before the May 18 cutoff date. I’ll call tomorrow to ask...

[TheBingoBalls]

Originally Posted by keylime503

I'm talking about placing a factory order for the exact same spec on the exact same day. Why is one dealer giving a huge discount relative to the other one? Why did one dealer have to "buy" that car from BMW for a promo? Why are there various ways dealerships can receive cars outside of their required order banks?

I'm sorry but you're just proving my point. The convoluted smoke and mirrors of middleman dealerships that compete against each other is the root of this problem. If dealerships were simply sales offices for the manufacturer who are required to sell each car at exactly the price you see on the manufacturer's website, all of this goes away.

You're looking at every car and dealership as the same and thinking that you are the only one not being privy to a deal that you think is a common occurrence. There is no smoke and mirrors. You just weren't shopping at the right time.

These promo vehicles for example aren't given because BMW favours the dealership. The dealership might be holding and paying for their own event for self-marketing and they need a car. BMW can't just give them a vehicle so they will sell that one vehicle to the dealer at a discount say 15%. If you happen to be there, you have every opportunity to buy that car. If not, you're like everyone else that is likely getting the standard 6% or 7% discount on their regular in-stock vehicles.

[adc]

Originally Posted by alz0rz

Based on this bullet... I reckon something with respect to the EU insurance made this unfeasible.

"For the remaining orders which still qualify for European Delivery, these vehicles may not be operated on any racetracks or involved in any racing activities while they are in Europe."

It had been like that since at least 2018, ever since BMW changed insurance carriers for Euro Deliveries. In 2015 I was encouraged to go to the Nürburgring, the delivery specialist set up my M2 button for the Ring.

In 2018 they told me not to go. I went anyway.

[keylime503]

Originally Posted by TheBingoBalls

You're looking at every car and dealership as the same and thinking that you are the only one not being privy to a deal that you think is a common occurrence. There is no smoke and mirrors. You just weren't shopping at the right time.

These promo vehicles for example aren't given because BMW favours the dealership. The dealership might be holding and paying for their own event for self-marketing and they need a car. BMW can't just give them a vehicle so they will sell that one vehicle to the dealer at a discount say 15%. If you happen to be there, you have every opportunity to buy that car. If not, you're like everyone else that is likely getting the standard 6% or 7% discount on their regular in-stock vehicles.

Ok I'll bite. If that's the case, why doesn't BMW just have a set discount off MSRP for these promo cars that is public? So every single BMW will be sold at MSRP from every dealership in the country except these promo cars which will be sold at say 15% off MSRP *at every dealership in the country*. That's what transparency would look like. In such a world, "dealer cost" for a vehicle is irrelevant. Because the whole model of a dealership buying a car from BMW and selling it to me is irrelevant. I should be able to just buy the car from BMW for BMW's price. If a dealership network is needed to provide physical locations to do that transaction, so be it.

[TheBingoBalls]

Originally Posted by adc

It had been like that since at least 2018, ever since BMW changed insurance carriers for Euro Deliveries. In 2015 I was encouraged to go to the Nürburgring, the delivery specialist set up my M2 button for the Ring.

In 2018 they told me not to go. I went anyway.

Forget the cost of insurance, dealing with the paperwork between Germany and the dealership was a nightmare because there seemed to be a breakdown in communication from both the dealer and BMW. We had one ED where Germany didn't update the status of the licensing/insurance until after the customer was already on the plane when we were told that it wouldn't be done in time when the customer landed so the customer didn't have that much of a ED. Customer was beyond infuriated.

[cooolone2]

One day... Thread 11 pages deep!

It's not the end of the world... And a company that centers it's business model on the "Experience" is certainly not going to dump one of its most cherished programs in the trash pile. I'm sure, when the new normal returns, and sales and tourism normalizes, things will be as they were. Is no use crying over little bumps in the road for now. It isn't like they made $ off of the program... It was all about the customer and the experience! No way they're going to move away from that, otherwise it might as well just be a Toyota! Lol

Just my $.02

[Poochie]

Originally Posted by cooolone2

No way they're going to move away from that, otherwise it might as well just be a Toyota!

Toyota is the best selling automobile manufacture in the entire free world, BMW wish they could be a Toyota..

[///M4ster Yoda]

Originally Posted by Poochie

Toyota is the best selling automobile manufacture in the entire free world, BMW wish they could be a Toyota..

They are certainly trying

[JCZ5]

Originally Posted by Poochie

Toyota is the best selling automobile manufacture in the entire free world, BMW wish they could be a Toyota..

+1

In addition to the number 1 most valuable automotive brand...

Toyota has the most advanced manufacturing system and pioneered the lean six sigma methodology that is now used throughout all aspects of work regardless of which field you're in.

Who knew making boring people carriers are so profitable and will gain you notoriety.

And yes, all large volume manufactures follow suit in how Toyota carries out their operations and aspire to where Toyota is in the automotive space.

[Pyrat 2]

A very sad day but not unexpected. They have been transitioning to an SUV company for years and straying away from the values of the ultimate driving machine that propelled them to the top. Imagine going for a Welt type of experience for a RAV4. I've purchased 6 new BMWs since 2001 as well as 3 used ones. I'll continue to look at them for SAV/SUV purchases but they lost me on the 'car/sport sedan' front. My last two cars have been P-cars after selling off my M2. It's hard for me to part with the brand after two decades but every day draws me further into the P-car and further away from the BMW brand.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by Pyrat 2

A very sad day but not unexpected. They have been transitioning to an SUV company for years and straying away from the values of the ultimate driving machine that propelled them to the top. Imagine going for a Welt type of experience for a RAV4. I've purchased 6 new BMWs since 2001 as well as 3 used ones. I'll continue to look at them for SAV/SUV purchases but they lost me on the 'car/sport sedan' front. My last two cars have been P-cars after selling off my M2. It's hard for me to part with the brand after two decades but every day draws me further into the P-car and further away from the BMW brand.

This is an interesting perspective considering the fact that SUV's are keeping EVERYBODY afloat, including Porsche. You make it seem like it's only BMW. Do you remember how the Porsche crowd reacted when it was announced than an SUV was coming?!?Porsche can't sustain themselves solely on the 911 any more than BMW can sustain themselves solely on sporty cars. The world is not full of enthusiasts! Short memories indeed.

[TheBingoBalls]

Originally Posted by keylime503

Ok I'll bite. If that's the case, why doesn't BMW just have a set discount off MSRP for these promo cars that is public? So every single BMW will be sold at MSRP from every dealership in the country except these promo cars which will be sold at say 15% off MSRP *at every dealership in the country*. That's what transparency would look like. In such a world, "dealer cost" for a vehicle is irrelevant. Because the whole model of a dealership buying a car from BMW and selling it to me is irrelevant. I should be able to just buy the car from BMW for BMW's price. If a dealership network is needed to provide physical locations to do that transaction, so be it.

First, I 100% agree with you and I am for that model - I have even posted previously that I commend dealerships that have moved to a one price model.

The discount on those promo vehicles is irrelevant, I was responding to your question why people get significantly better than average deals that are rare but speak like it's an every day thing. That was one example of how and why it's possible.

[TheBingoBalls]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

This is an interesting perspective considering the fact that SUV's are keeping EVERYBODY afloat, including Porsche. You make it seem like it's only BMW. Do you remember how the Porsche crowd reacted when it was announced than an SUV was coming?!?Porsche can't sustain themselves solely on the 911 any more than BMW can sustain themselves solely on sporty cars. The world is not full of enthusiasts! Short memories indeed.

I can tell you they were a lot more receptive and understanding of the need for the Cayenne than BMW enthusiasts were when the X5 came!

[hans007]

i regret not having done this on my m340i since i've always wanted to and mine was an order, was just too busy to take the trip.

that said, given the production of so many BMWs wont even be in europe in the future (with basically all 3 series, and X models here, and the 2 series eventually moving here) , it seems like it was going to be a shrinking number of cars you could do euro delivery with anyway.

So 4/5/7 series and the Z4 in the future would have been it anyway.