[Bc2005]

The Bronco Sport is a Ford Escape (not Explorer) with a more muscular looking body. To many folks this is not a problem because they buy it as a replacement for a small SUV. The larger Bronco is designed to compete with the Jeep Wrangler, and it apparently does a good job in that market.

[TheWatchGuy]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

This is an exaggeration of the situation.

the wait times?

ford is way behind on 2022s right now. so behind, they had to cut off ordering 2022s a couple months earlier than usual. my experience so far with ordering an f150 is at least 5 months behind the schedule my dealer told me when I ordered, which was a 4-6 month wait. Broncos are worse. Now, if you order through a dealership that moves a ton of units and gets a high allocation, you may get lucky and get it quicker.

the wait times get worse and worse every week as ford cuts lines, cuts scheduling, and places certain features on hold.

[991C2]

I'm ordering a new Bronco in August when the 2023 orders open up (a friend of mine owns a Ford dealership).

I LOVE the look of the new Bronco! It looks totally badass on the road. It's much bigger than I thought it would be (a little more room than the wife's 2022 X3) and had real road presence. It's very rugged (mine will have no carpet, drain plugs and marine grade vinyl seats for easy wash out/cleaning.

I've had Wranglers in the past and have driven the latest Wrangler. It's night and day difference in the way the Wrangler and Bronco drive on the road. The Wrangler feels old whereas the Bronco feels modern and much more controlled. There's a feeling of roominess in the Bronco that you just don't get in the Wrangler.
I don't really care about the differences in IFS vs. live axle front suspension for off-roading. The vast majority of the time I'll be driving it on-road so that argument goes out the window. When I do take it off-road, it'll be fine.

I'll order with the following options:
Black Diamond (Badlands isn't worth the $3k upcharge for headlights and sway bar disconnects)
Cyber Orange - I'll see if Ford offers a different color that I like when orders open up, but I'm pretty set on this one
Soft top - unless the wait for a hardtop doesn't affect delivery
Modular Bumper
V6/automatic
Sasquatch Package
Mid Package
Tow Package

When I was driving my Wranglers and other people would complain about it, I would say "It's a Jeep thing, you wouldn't understand."
Same goes for the Bronco and new Wrangler. Roof off and doors off, plus a ton of fun in the snow - they're very versatile and a ton of fun.

[heavyD^2]

The wait times are horrible and there's no rhyme or reason to their allocation method as some people have received theirs within 6 months after ordering and plenty of people that ordered in 2021 are still waiting for Broncos. I had one on order but bailed after 7 months of my order sitting at "unscheduled clean status" which means it will come when it comes, maybe this year, maybe next year. Besides there's lots of teething issues with these vehicles.

[dgoldenz]

Originally Posted by heavyD^2

The wait times are horrible and there's no rhyme or reason to their allocation method as some people have received theirs within 6 months after ordering and plenty of people that ordered in 2021 are still waiting for Broncos. I had one on order but bailed after 7 months of my order sitting at "unscheduled clean status" which means it will come when it comes, maybe this year, maybe next year. Besides there's lots of teething issues with these vehicles.

Same with Jeep. Ordered my 392 Wrangler early November 2021, still hasn't even been scheduled to build yet. Meanwhile people who ordered 6 weeks ago have gotten their cars already.

[991C2]

Originally Posted by dgoldenz

Same with Jeep. Ordered my 392 Wrangler early November 2021, still hasn't even been scheduled to build yet. Meanwhile people who ordered 6 weeks ago have gotten their cars already.

I think a lot has to do with allocation for the dealerships.
On the Ford front, the large dealerships are getting a ton of Bronco's in and have quite a few Raptor allocations as well.
My buddy is a smaller dealership (although he is getting a good number of Bronco's), he's only getting one Raptor allocation for 2023. I asked because I would have gotten that instead and I don't want to pay over sticker for my next vehicle.

[dgoldenz]

Originally Posted by 991C2

I think a lot has to do with allocation for the dealerships.
On the Ford front, the large dealerships are getting a ton of Bronco's in and have quite a few Raptor allocations as well.
My buddy is a smaller dealership (although he is getting a good number of Bronco's), he's only getting one Raptor allocation for 2023. I asked because I would have gotten that instead and I don't want to pay over sticker for my next vehicle.

I ordered from one of the highest volume dealerships. There's simply no rhyme or reason for what gets built and in what order.

[OF Hero]

Hoping by this time next year we know what Toyota's next gen 4Runner offering will look like. And then I'll decide between the two.

[NYG]

Would never buy a Ford even if I love the Raptor.

Chevy > Ford > Dodge

[Piper1]

Originally Posted by heavyD^2

The wait times are horrible and there's no rhyme or reason to their allocation method as some people have received theirs within 6 months after ordering and plenty of people that ordered in 2021 are still waiting for Broncos. I had one on order but bailed after 7 months of my order sitting at "unscheduled clean status" which means it will come when it comes, maybe this year, maybe next year. Besides there's lots of teething issues with these vehicles.

There’s a bit of reasoning on some for delivery. There was a quality issue with the vendor with the paint of the hard tops with the color. Those that opted for soft top or later changed hard to soft top hot there’s quicker while the lots filled up waiting for new tops from the vendor.

[dgoldenz]

Base price on the 392 just went up another $5k....$75k last year, $82k now. Glad I ordered when I did...I'm sure the Bronco won't be far behind on the price increases.

[Piper1]

Originally Posted by NYG

Would never buy a Ford even if I love the Raptor.

Chevy > Ford > Dodge

My first car was a Chevy. I won’t buy Chevy now based on principle. Last contract gms ceo didn’t want to give wage increases in manufacturing due to wanting to stay competitive with foreign manufacturing. But at the same time was unwilling to take a huge pay cut to match Toyotas ceo. Meanwhile 300 at fords top took 20-50% their pay deferred for least 5 months when the start up the chip shortage happened. https://www.freep.com/story/money/ca...tt/2915125001/

I am more about what vehicle rather than brand as to my main focus of car. And as much as I love the c7&c8 I couldn’t bring myself now to own one. Have had 2 dodges and they just don’t make anything new that sparks my interest.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by TheWatchGuy

the wait times?

ford is way behind on 2022s right now. so behind, they had to cut off ordering 2022s a couple months earlier than usual. my experience so far with ordering an f150 is at least 5 months behind the schedule my dealer told me when I ordered, which was a 4-6 month wait. Broncos are worse. Now, if you order through a dealership that moves a ton of units and gets a high allocation, you may get lucky and get it quicker.

the wait times get worse and worse every week as ford cuts lines, cuts scheduling, and places certain features on hold.

The biggest constraint has been the MIC (molded in color) top. The MIC production issues has absolutely strangled 2-door production and seriously hampered 4-door models. Higher trims with more computer modules has also delayed production. Order a lower trim level in 4-door with a soft top, Ford practically shoots those out the door.

I was addressing your MY '23 comment. The 1.5 to 2 year wait you speak of includes the July '20 Reservation time to late June '21 start of full-rate factory production; some 300 days when there was no possibility of production. Once most of the original 125,000 orders from 2021 are completed this year, I doubt MY '23 production will take 1.5 to 2 years to fullfil an order.

The hard top maker is adding a second production line (new facility) to fill MIC top production requirements. The chip shortage, well that's a crapshoot for any product at this point.

[NYG]

Originally Posted by Piper1

My first car was a Chevy. I won’t buy Chevy now based on principle. Last contract gms ceo didn’t want to give wage increases in manufacturing due to wanting to stay competitive with foreign manufacturing. But at the same time was unwilling to take a huge pay cut to match Toyotas ceo. Meanwhile 300 at fords top took 20-50% their pay deferred for least 5 months when the start up the chip shortage happened. https://www.freep.com/story/money/ca...tt/2915125001/

I am more about what vehicle rather than brand as to my main focus of car. And as much as I love the c7&c8 I couldn’t bring myself now to own one. Have had 2 dodges and they just don’t make anything new that sparks my interest.

You won't buy anything if you look at brands in that way.

Henry Ford was quite the close friend of Hitler and the nazi war machine.

Business partner got the new Shelby GT500 - gorgeous car, fast, in the shop every week for ridiculous stuff

At LEAST 5 people I personally know have had their stock Shelby GT350 engines completely explode on the race track. Probably the worst engine Ford has ever designed.

Friend's GT had a piece of 2 cent plastic connecting the starter ground completely shear off mid-track session.

Powerstrokes - don't even get me started on how much they suck.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by NYG

You won't buy anything if you look at brands in that way.

Henry Ford was quite the close friend of Hitler and the nazi war machine.

Business partner got the new Shelby GT500 - gorgeous car, fast, in the shop every week for ridiculous stuff

At LEAST 5 people I personally know have had their stock Shelby GT350 engines completely explode on the race track. Probably the worst engine Ford has ever designed.

Friend's GT had a piece of 2 cent plastic connecting the starter ground completely shear off mid-track session.

Powerstrokes - don't even get me started on how much they suck.

Gee, what did BMW build for Hilter? Lol.

[NYG]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

Gee, what did BMW build for Hilter? Lol.

Exactly - it's why I don't give 2 chits about any of these companies and their policies unless they're giving me free cars. They all blow.

[heavyD^2]

Originally Posted by NYG

Would never buy a Ford even if I love the Raptor.

Chevy > Ford > Dodge

Nah. They are all the same for the most part with maybe Dodge pulling in the rear a little because of Jeep. I have owned good and bad from all the domestics as there's not much to choose between them as you nearly always get build and interior quality a level below the Japanese and Germans and the key is to accept them on a value level. It's why the Corvette and pony cars are so great as you get a lot of performance for the dollar. Their SUV's and regular cars are only viable when highly discounted. That's kind of where the Bronco and Jeeps fail as they are overpriced for what are pretty shoddily put together vehicles. Doesn't change the fact that I wanted one because the Bronco is pretty cool and carries a lot of nostalgia.

[Piper1]

Originally Posted by NYG

You won't buy anything if you look at brands in that way.

Henry Ford was quite the close friend of Hitler and the nazi war machine.

Business partner got the new Shelby GT500 - gorgeous car, fast, in the shop every week for ridiculous stuff

At LEAST 5 people I personally know have had their stock Shelby GT350 engines completely explode on the race track. Probably the worst engine Ford has ever designed.

Friend's GT had a piece of 2 cent plastic connecting the starter ground completely shear off mid-track session.

Powerstrokes - don't even get me started on how much they suck.

Not going to touch the political hands into the auto industry of who’s hand jobbing who in this thread plenty still going on in our life time including a certain someone who said let the auto industry go bankrupt. Ford didn’t take the bail out instead put the blue oval as collateral which loans all got paid back.

From issues and recalls basing car buying on that you wouldn’t buy anything either including bmw just to point to 2 recall letters with no know fix on the n52 crank case heaters catching fires that I received. Also knowing the m54 pcv system I understand why the heaters were put on the n52. Coming from a Supra with a 7mgte being bhg prone seeing milky oil in my Z4 you can imagine what I thought and finding out it’s the faults of the pcv on the m54. And even Ferrari wasn’t immune from the takata recall. So we all have our own reasons for buying what we do. Any compliment I get on my e85 I kindly thank and add it’s been blood sweat and tears of a car/build.

And I totally get certain logic on wanting reliability or the illusion of it. It’s a reason I chose a e82 to have as a kid hauler and not a focus or fusion. And personally I wish they’d stop calling the escape and any other new suv in the class including X series a suv and call it what it is, the new mini van. But that’s marketing for you and understand why from the years I spent in retail. Sorry for the rant.

[Piper1]

Originally Posted by NYG

Exactly - it's why I don't give 2 chits about any of these companies and their policies unless they're giving me free cars. They all blow.

You might not care but I take great pride being able to walk my son up to a f150 and be able to point and say see that. I machined this along with your uncle and it’s what puts food on our table.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by Piper1

Not going to touch the political hands into the auto industry of who’s hand jobbing who in this thread plenty still going on in our life time including a certain someone who said let the auto industry go bankrupt. Ford didn’t take the bail out instead put the blue oval as collateral which loans all got paid back.

From issues and recalls basing car buying on that you wouldn’t buy anything either including bmw just to point to 2 recall letters with no know fix on the n52 crank case heaters catching fires that I received. Also knowing the m54 pcv system I understand why the heaters were put on the n52. Coming from a Supra with a 7mgte being bhg prone seeing milky oil in my Z4 you can imagine what I thought and finding out it’s the faults of the pcv on the m54. And even Ferrari wasn’t immune from the takata recall. So we all have our own reasons for buying what we do. Any compliment I get on my e85 I kindly thank and add it’s been blood sweat and tears of a car/build.

And I totally get certain logic on wanting reliability or the illusion of it. It’s a reason I chose a e82 to have as a kid hauler and not a focus or fusion. And personally I wish they’d stop calling the escape and any other new suv in the class including X series a suv and call it what it is, the new mini van. But that’s marketing for you and understand why from the years I spent in retail. Sorry for the rant.

Considering the thousands of threads Ive read over the years since I joined in 2006 about not keeping a BMW past the warranty period, I'll take it that BMW's have a reliability reputation no better than the Domestics. Keep in mind, I have about 950,000 driven miles accumulated on 5 Bimmers since 1988. My current operating fleet is at 727K in total chassis miles. I've had one Acura, one GM truck (still have it), and 7 Fords. None of them have been much better or much worse than the others. All machines break.

I'll bet my Bronco will fit into my Average I've experienced so far.

[TheWatchGuy]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

The biggest constraint has been the MIC (molded in color) top. The MIC production issues has absolutely strangled 2-door production and seriously hampered 4-door models. Higher trims with more computer modules has also delayed production. Order a lower trim level in 4-door with a soft top, Ford practically shoots those out the door.

I was addressing your MY '23 comment. The 1.5 to 2 year wait you speak of includes the July '20 Reservation time to late June '21 start of full-rate factory production; some 300 days when there was no possibility of production. Once most of the original 125,000 orders from 2021 are completed this year, I doubt MY '23 production will take 1.5 to 2 years to fullfil an order.

The hard top maker is adding a second production line (new facility) to fill MIC top production requirements. The chip shortage, well that's a crapshoot for any product at this point.

i agree a 21 shouldnt take 1.5-2yrs. based on what ive seen, its been closer to 8-12 months once they officially went in to production and people without reservations started ordering. the hard top was one of the issues, but the latest issues ford is facing is much more than just that. everything from LEDs to seats to chips and everything in between.

but moving forward, and since about january, ford has been delaying delivery timelines on everything every month. like i said, F150s went from about 4 months earlier this year to now 8-12+ months. i dont know how many orders they have for broncos, or how many they plan on producing, but its a safe bet its gonna be at least that and most likely more once 2023s order banks open. Id be happy to be wrong, but right now, its only getting worse.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by TheWatchGuy

i agree a 21 shouldnt take 1.5-2yrs. based on what ive seen, its been closer to 8-12 months once they officially went in to production and people without reservations started ordering. the hard top was one of the issues, but the latest issues ford is facing is much more than just that. everything from LEDs to seats to chips and everything in between.

but moving forward, and since about january, ford has been delaying delivery timelines on everything every month. like i said, F150s went from about 4 months earlier this year to now 8-12+ months. i dont know how many orders they have for broncos, or how many they plan on producing, but its a safe bet its gonna be at least that and most likely more once 2023s order banks open. Id be happy to be wrong, but right now, its only getting worse.

Some people's Broncos have been built for months (modules and all) there are not enough trucks to ship them... cough-cough.

Maybe manufacturers will start designing cars without all the BS tech in them to keep away from 3rd world supply chain sources... I'll be happy to pay more for domestic sourcing of parts.