[-=Hot|Ice=-]

Originally Posted by hanmaas

If they seriously consider building a V6, then I would seriously consider choosing the C63 over the M3.

Btw, whats your sig supposed to mean, I'm trying to make sense out of it...?

+1

[hanmaas]

Originally Posted by MenTul

Kein Mitleid Fur Die Mehrheit = No Mercy for the Masses

I know what it translates to, but couldn't associate any further meaning. A quick look on Wikipedia revealed that it is a German Industrial Rock Band. Is that what you're referring to?

[MenTul]

Originally Posted by Autobahn335i

Inline-6 engines are doomed to disappear. Main problem is that they take up too much space, therefore require long hoods, and are not very suitable for multi-platform use. Sad but true

The problem isn't hood length. You can't mount an I6 transversely to support FWD application.

This is not a problem for premium brands such as BMW and MB since they do not share platforms with FWD cars (ie. Audi & VW). Should this change, buying cars will be the same as going blind into a store that sells shit and only being able to choose by the smell (very similar to US election booths).

[noro]

Before you go and have an emotional breakdown over the fact that a V6 is worse than a V8 I suggest to do some learning about engines in general.

My M3 can keep up with lots of other V8s on the track and it only has a 4 cylinder NA engine. BMW is trying to get back into smaller lighter and more nimble cars. If you want a Pontiac GTO go get one... just make it quick before they shut down the factory.

[mapezzul]

First let me say I am not trying to cross link or post to an another site for promotion- there is just no feasible way for me to re-write with diagrams the explanation of the new CCM in the turbo ///M V8 effectively while explaining the future as BMW sees it.

Description of the new ///M V8

How this pertains to this post is simple- read between the lines of what it states in the break down of this motor. There will be future offerings using this motor and the tech in it.

There are two methods being explored for the next M3 (the M5/M6 will be similar to the current turbo with some changes in power delivery etc. from what I gather)

The V6 is one option that is being tested with a CCM though it is said to be less refined then BMW would like, the other option is an inline 6 with another new way of plumbing the turbos- it will also be a radical departure from current ideas of inline 6s

BMW is actually quite opposed to the V6 as Audi and their parasitic supercharger will be heading to market soon and they see it as a cheap/cost gap solution which they can share with all the other VW brands; BMW wants no part of even being mentioned in such light so that is why unless the BMW CCM V6 is a far superior product than the other options they will not do it.

The reason for the FI is because there is no other way for BMW to get emissions even lower and produce the needed power/weight ratio. Even with making cars lighter it will be difficult.

We shall all see though...

[-=Hot|Ice=-]

If BMW goes the V6 route, I'm gone. End of story. The I6 is what makes a BMW, a BMW.

[T Bone]

Originally Posted by -=Hot|Ice=-

If BMW goes the V6 route, I'm gone. End of story. The I6 is what makes a BMW, a BMW.

V8 V10 and V12's are all good BMW engines.... not V6, inherently vibration prone.


At this rate, BMW might as well outsource its engines to Chrysler if wants a V6. <sarcasm added>

[3002 tii]

Originally Posted by -=Hot|Ice=-

If BMW changes to V's....I may just leave. BMW's I6 is epic. It's historic and it's what has made them the company they are today. You can't stray away from heritage. I swear, the day Mercedes went V6 was the day that it all went to hell. The day BMW uses a V6, Hell will freeze over.

that's what enthusiasts said about bmw switching from a flat twin boxer to 4 cylinder engine on their motorcycles but their k-series have been kicking a$$ since day 1!

[Artz 330]

i drove the e92 M3 several times and that car feels dead to me too.. Nothing like the S54 which had heart and soul.. these new M's feel watered down...

[ENINTY]

Originally Posted by Dubbedown

that's what enthusiasts said about bmw switching from a flat twin boxer to 4 cylinder engine on their motorcycles but their k-series have been kicking a$$ since day 1!

And then BMW came out with the oil-head flat twin...

And the flying brick is now a transverse in-line 4, like every other Japanese bike.

When BMW goes to a V6 with a 90 deg. block (based off the M V8) and has to use counter balancers to smooth it out, it will be like every other manufacturer. No reason to buy one. Can't wait until BMW drops manual transmissions from the US market too.

If BMW needs to get more power for the M3, why didn't it make a 3.5 in-line six with turbos?

[mapezzul]

Originally Posted by ENINTY

And then BMW came out with the oil-head flat twin...

And the flying brick is now a transverse in-line 4, like every other Japanese bike.

When BMW goes to a V6 with a 90 deg. block (based off the M V8) and has to use counter balancers to smooth it out, it will be like every other manufacturer. No reason to buy one. Can't wait until BMW drops manual transmissions from the US market too.

If BMW needs to get more power for the M3, why didn't it make a 3.5 in-line six with turbos?

They don't need more power from the ///M3. People are missing the point to all this- they need less green house gases, lower emissions and greater efficiency, they can't do it the NA route neither can anyone else. The pending changes to emissions regulations is forcing this and it is NOT their choice.

an inline six with multiple turbos is also in the works... as I stated earlier in this thread.

they have power, efficiency and emissions numbers they must hit with each motor, whatever they come up with will be the best solution to the problem. BMW is not VW/Audi they are not designing an engine for multiple brands and strapping a super charger on a V6.

[footie]

Originally Posted by mapezzul

They don't need more power from the ///M3. People are missing the point to all this- they need less green house gases, lower emissions and greater efficiency, they can't do it the NA route neither can anyone else. The pending changes to emissions regulations is forcing this and it is NOT their choice.

an inline six with multiple turbos is also in the works... as I stated earlier in this thread.

they have power, efficiency and emissions numbers they must hit with each motor, whatever they come up with will be the best solution to the problem. BMW is not VW/Audi they are not designing an engine for multiple brands and strapping a super charger on a V6.

Agreed,

It's funny but I sit and read some of the posts regarding the shift to Forced Induction and laugh out loud at the negative comments like BMW are selling out. Give me a break, every manufacturer is in the same boat, check out the 2015 emission regulations and you will see that no one has a choice in the matter.

A bit harsh with the comments on VW/Audi, the truth is all companies use engines that appear else where, think the Mini and you know what I mean. The 3.0TFSI in the S4 is actually a pretty decent engine, check out the power and torque curve and you will see it has more torque everywhere compared to the S5's 4.2v8. I did hear that Audi actually had two versions of the V6 testing, one you see here today and another that had twin turbos. Why they choice the supercharger instead of the turbos is any one's guess but they clearly had their reasons and it must have had to do with more than just efficiency and emissions.

It will be interesting to see how the new 4.4tt in the X6M performs, whether or not the lag for the turbos are completely gone or just reduced to a level that's not really noticeable.

P.S.

Look forward to hearing what you find out about the DCT.

[ENINTY]

Originally Posted by mapezzul

They don't need more power from the ///M3. People are missing the point to all this- they need less green house gases, lower emissions and greater efficiency, they can't do it the NA route neither can anyone else. The pending changes to emissions regulations is forcing this and it is NOT their choice.

an inline six with multiple turbos is also in the works... as I stated earlier in this thread.

they have power, efficiency and emissions numbers they must hit with each motor, whatever they come up with will be the best solution to the problem. BMW is not VW/Audi they are not designing an engine for multiple brands and strapping a super charger on a V6.

The E9X M3 has a V8 because BMW couldn't make the HP numbers that the Benz AMG and Audi S4 do with a 3.0L in-line six. So I guess the next round of performance sedans from BMW, Merc, and Audi will tout their low green house emissions? Oh Boy can't wait for that.

BMW already has a in-line six with multipule turbos... The one with the fuel pump problems.

BMW already uses the 7-Series motor in the Rolls Royce.

[pleasanton335]

Originally Posted by ENINTY

The E9X M3 has a V8 because BMW couldn't make the HP numbers that the Benz AMG and Audi S4 do with a 3.0L in-line six. So I guess the next round of performance sedans from BMW, Merc, and Audi will tout their low green house emissions? Oh Boy can't wait for that.

BMW already has a in-line six with multipule turbos... The one with the fuel pump problems.

BMW already uses the 7-Series motor in the Rolls Royce.

The S4 has never had an in-line six. B5 S4 was bi-turbo V6, and B8 is Supercharged V6.