[Artemis]

Originally Posted by M5Rick

He's not quite in the last chance saloon so it's not over yet.

Originally Posted by M5Rick

Aha now I know.

It's not only about his subpar performance on track in the RBR car, it's also about resisting to make arrogant statements when getting baited by the press. Pretty iIl-advised to go dissing Tsunoda this race weekend. Or as someone commented: "Talking smack about someone who’s handily beating you in an inferior car is not the way to go". Speak with results, not with arrogant words.

Published prior to Lawson's P20 in the GP qualies:

"Lawson: Tsunoda ‘had his time – I beat him in the junior series’
Racefans - 21 March 2025
https://www.racefans.net/2025/03/21/...junior-series/
Liam Lawson has rejected claims Red Bull made a mistake by promoting him instead of his 2024 team mate to their senior team this year.
He is competing in his second weekend for Red Bull after the team hired him to replace Sergio Perez at the end of last season.
Yuki Tsunoda, who was Lawson’s team mate at Red Bull’s second team when last season ended, was also in the running for the seat. Having already spent four years in F1, Tsunoda is significantly more experienced than Lawson, who had entered only 11 grands prix before this season began.
Lawson endured a difficult start at Red Bull, dropping out in Q1 at Melbourne, then crashing out of the race when he tried to stay on slick tyres during a shower. He qualified last for this weekend’s sprint race in Shanghai.
But Lawson insists he was the better choice for Red Bull and said he had no sympathy for Tsunoda being overlooked. “If I look back over our careers, I was team mates with him in F3 and I beat him,” he told The Telegraph. “In Euroformula I was team mates with him, [and] in New Zealand, and I beat him there.
“Then in F1 last season I think honestly, if I look at all the times he got promoted instead of me in those early years, then no. He’s had his time. Now it’s my time.”
Tsunoda and Lawson were team mates many times during their junior careers. Lawson out-scored Tsunoda in the 2019 Euroformula Open, where both drove for Motopark. The order was reversed in the FIA F3 series that year, though they drove for different teams.
They faced each other again in the New Zealand Toyota Racing Series the following year. Lawson narrowly failed to reclaim the title he won the year before while Tsunoda, making his debut in the series, finished fourth.
McLaren Racing CEO Zak Brown is among those who queried Red Bull’s decision to promote Lawson instead of Tsunoda. Lawson said he “couldn’t care less” about his opinion. “I think he’s still hurt because I talked about his national anthem,” he said.
However Lawson admitted he was impressed by Verstappen’s performance in Melbourne last week. “Just the way he gets up to speed and gets straight on it, you know?” he said. “There’s no delay, there’s no warm-up.”

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by Artemis

It's not only about his subpar performance on track in the RBR car, it's also about resisting to make arrogant statements when getting baited by the press. Pretty iIl-advised to go dissing Tsunoda this race weekend. Or as someone commented: "Talking smack about someone who’s handily beating you in an inferior car is not the way to go". Speak with results, not with arrogant words.

Published prior to Lawson's P20 in the GP qualies:

"Lawson: Tsunoda ‘had his time – I beat him in the junior series’
Racefans - 21 March 2025
https://www.racefans.net/2025/03/21/...junior-series/
Liam Lawson has rejected claims Red Bull made a mistake by promoting him instead of his 2024 team mate to their senior team this year.
He is competing in his second weekend for Red Bull after the team hired him to replace Sergio Perez at the end of last season.
Yuki Tsunoda, who was Lawson’s team mate at Red Bull’s second team when last season ended, was also in the running for the seat. Having already spent four years in F1, Tsunoda is significantly more experienced than Lawson, who had entered only 11 grands prix before this season began.
Lawson endured a difficult start at Red Bull, dropping out in Q1 at Melbourne, then crashing out of the race when he tried to stay on slick tyres during a shower. He qualified last for this weekend’s sprint race in Shanghai.
But Lawson insists he was the better choice for Red Bull and said he had no sympathy for Tsunoda being overlooked. “If I look back over our careers, I was team mates with him in F3 and I beat him,” he told The Telegraph. “In Euroformula I was team mates with him, [and] in New Zealand, and I beat him there.
“Then in F1 last season I think honestly, if I look at all the times he got promoted instead of me in those early years, then no. He’s had his time. Now it’s my time.”
Tsunoda and Lawson were team mates many times during their junior careers. Lawson out-scored Tsunoda in the 2019 Euroformula Open, where both drove for Motopark. The order was reversed in the FIA F3 series that year, though they drove for different teams.
They faced each other again in the New Zealand Toyota Racing Series the following year. Lawson narrowly failed to reclaim the title he won the year before while Tsunoda, making his debut in the series, finished fourth.
McLaren Racing CEO Zak Brown is among those who queried Red Bull’s decision to promote Lawson instead of Tsunoda. Lawson said he “couldn’t care less” about his opinion. “I think he’s still hurt because I talked about his national anthem,” he said.
However Lawson admitted he was impressed by Verstappen’s performance in Melbourne last week. “Just the way he gets up to speed and gets straight on it, you know?” he said. “There’s no delay, there’s no warm-up.”

Looks like it's the beginnings of Liam being between a rock and a hard place, hopefully not.
Mainly the tricky 21 and strange timings getting a competitive time. His frustration bringing up things that have happened in the past may be impacting on his progress and it brings me to how RBR are managing his timings.
It's no good to drive angry which can only mean a more slippery slope for him but he has more time to shake off the demons and his family should turn up to the race to support him in the box.

[wizardofOz]

Originally Posted by M5Rick

So far the way things are going, I'm the only one offering for that second seat (kidding)

For my two cents, I think Yuki will perform better in his current car than next to Max in the other...I think his current car actually is pretty fast

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by wizardofOz

For my two cents, I think Yuki will perform better in his current car than next to Max in the other...I think his current car actually is pretty fast

The Racing Bull version is easier to drive from what I can see and it now has the similar pull rod front suspension to it's bigger brother car so I agree Yuki should stay where he is as it looks like he'll have his hands full dicing with Hadjar but if it continues to go wrong for Liam then Yuki could be forced into that second 21 seat whether he likes it or not with Liam back in VCARB I would think.

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by M5Rick

The Racing Bull version is easier to drive from what I can see and it now has the similar pull rod front suspension to it's bigger brother car so I agree Yuki should stay where he is as it looks like he'll have his hands full dicing with Hadjar but if it continues to go wrong for Liam then Yuki could be forced into that second 21 seat whether he likes it or not with Liam back in VCARB I would think.

The sprint race :

Think 'Slowson bumped will all the other rookies to reach P14 in the sprint race .
Slowson is P14 in the QF and Hadjar at P13 .This means a 'Bowling game in the race (!)

The QF :

They put MAX on a race setup in the QF . Because his fronts were gone in 7 laps in the sprint race .
After 10 laps his both fronts were completely dead (!)
Already in lap 5 , his left front tire started to show graining . While he tried to save his tires...
This track eats tires in no time , and especially the left front tire (!)
That's why they have put MAX on a race setup to save his tires in the race..
But MAX's race setup will s@ck too , because the RB21 setup is still an endless puzzle.
The race is for McLaren , their tires last forever with their genius tire cooling invention..

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by M5Rick

The Racing Bull version is easier to drive from what I can see and it now has the similar pull rod front suspension to it's bigger brother car so I agree Yuki should stay where he is as it looks like he'll have his hands full dicing with Hadjar but if it continues to go wrong for Liam then Yuki could be forced into that second 21 seat whether he likes it or not with Liam back in VCARB I would think.

Verstappen told Dutch media the following after the Shangai qualies:

"If you looked at Liam at Racing Bulls, actually he was quite similar to Yuki [on pace]. There was not a whole lot of difference between them, I thought. Otherwise, of course, the team wouldn't make that choice to put Liam in [to Red Bull]. And now suddenly that gap is very big and they are also very close to me. So of course that tells you something. If you would put Liam in the Racing Bulls, he will go quicker."
("What’s going wrong for Liam Lawson at Red Bull?": https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/w...bull/10706032/)

Albon explained the situation in 2023. As a consequence, it's getting increasingly difficult for most RBR drivers to keep up with Verstappen's pace. Ever since Perez collapsed in May 2024, Verstappen is virtually left to his own devices during races: unlike most teams, as good as no help from his wingman. A wingman is supposed to help attacking and defending track positions. If Verstappen would leave RBR to replace Russell or Alonso, or would take a sabbatical for family reasons, RBR will be in shambles.

Lawson is thrown before the lions. So far, he impressed by underwhelming and questionable behavior - it's still early season, but time is ticking. Likely also Tsunoda would struggle with the 2025 RBR car. Trouble is that Tsunoda has a track record of anger management issues and RBR doesn't want expensive repair bills and hysteric onboard messages.

Required to drive the other 2015 RBR car: a seasoned driver with neither a big ego nor anger management issues.

Originally Posted by Artemis

"The Max Factor" consists of the racing skill to extract the maximum of what's practically extractable out of the tools and strategies put at an F1 driver's disposal.

Verstappen's former team mate Alex Albon basically explained (Dec 2023) that it's hard to keep up with Verstappen's evolution during a season - he operates on a different level with increasingly fine-tuned set-ups.

"The first thing is, you know, a lot of people say: "That car is built around him [Max Verstappen]", "He’s kind of like the Michael Schumacher of Ferrari, he’s created this team around him". But truthfully, the car is what it is, he is very quick. So what ends up happening is: he has quite a unique driving style, actually, it’s not that easy to get along with.
Everyone has a driving style. I would say my driving style [Alex Albon] is a bit more on the smooth side, but I like a car that has a good front-end, so quite sharp, quite direct. Max does too, but his level of sharp and direct is a whole different level – it’s eye-wateringly sharp.
To give people kind of maybe an explanation of what that might feel like. If you played computer games: if you bump up the sensitivity [on a computer mouse] completely to the max and you move that mouse and it’s just darting across the screen everywhere, that’s kind of how it feels. It becomes so sharp that it makes you a little bit tense.
So what ended up happening was, especially during my year: you start off being a little bit behind, but not by much. And then as the season goes on, and Max wants this front-end in the car, he wants his car to be sharper, sharper. And as it goes sharper and sharper, he goes quicker and quicker. And for you to catch up you have to start taking a little bit more risk. You might be a couple of tenths behind one session, just try a little bit more, ‘OK, I’ve gone off, I’ve had a crash’, and you’ve got to restart. Then you’ve lost a little bit of confidence, it takes a little bit more time, that gap is growing a little bit, and the next time you try and go out and do another job, [it’s] another spin or another whatever – and it just starts to snowball. And every time the car becomes sharper and sharper, you start to become more tense.
It’s like any sport, if you start to not be in that flow state, and you’re having to really think about it, and every time you go into a corner, you don’t know how it’s going to react, you don’t have that kind of… It’s purely the confidence in the car, the flow. It just doesn’t work, it never works."

See 00:01 - 02:37:

[Killed by Death]

#FerrariThings f**king up hammy's car

#CharlieThings, where you at bro

[Artemis]

[TheBingoBalls]

Originally Posted by Killed by Death

#FerrariThings f**king up hammy's car

#CharlieThings, where you at bro

I'm ok with the result if it means they know what they can or can't do with the set up for future races - still taking this as a learning exercise since the SF-25 is like 99% new.

Also, being 0.2xx behind PIA isn't the worse thing and something that could be overcome assuming Ferrari doesn't come with a botched strategy, but who are we kidding right?

Should be a fun and exciting GP.

[wizardofOz]

Well I mean for me, the RBR car is set up to cater for Max's driving style and anyone else sitting next to him has to follow suit.

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by wizardofOz

Well I mean for me, the RBR car is set up to cater for Max's driving style and anyone else sitting next to him has to follow suit.

I'm sure , It's otherwise..

The ideal RB21 setup is actually to get the max-performance out of the car at every track.
Which is normal for all the cars at the grid.

But drivers like Checo or Slowson can't drive the RB20/21 with this setup.
In other words : The RB21 setup is still a mess. Also for MAX's car.

[wizardofOz]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

I'm sure , It's otherwise..

The ideal RB21 setup is actually to get the max-performance out of the car at every track.
Which is normal for all the cars at the grid.

But drivers like Checo or Slowson can't drive the RB20/21 with this setup.
In other words : The RB21 setup is still a mess. Also for MAX's car.

Right now, I'm pretty sure there is more emphasis and focus on the guys being invested and developing more for the setup of next years' car...

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by wizardofOz

Right now, I'm pretty sure there is more emphasis and focus on the guys being invested and developing more for the setup of next years' car...

Yes and no ..

Look at Ferrari , all the parts and design of the 2025 Ferrari is for 99% new .
Depends how much you want the WDC or WCC . Or both..

And of course the 2026 F1 cars design will change completely...
The 2026 concept featured new "Active Aerodynamics" in both the front and rear wings. The concept saw the elimination of the drag reduction system, being replaced by a new manual override engine mode (!)

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by M5Rick

Looks like it's the beginnings of Liam being between a rock and a hard place, hopefully not.
Mainly the tricky 21 and strange timings getting a competitive time. His frustration bringing up things that have happened in the past may be impacting on his progress and it brings me to how RBR are managing his timings.
It's no good to drive angry which can only mean a more slippery slope for him but he has more time to shake off the demons and his family should turn up to the race to support him in the box.

The Greek FIA director Nicolas Tombazis :

Tombazis : We've seen with our cams that 4 teams still cheating (!)
McLaren , Ferrari, Mercedes and Williams.

With the McLaren car it was very clear , but the Williams Team still refuses to release the camera footage..

Interesting (!)

[///M Power-Belgium]

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

''Lawsons turn to go on the rack .. ouch !

[G30M]

Originally Posted by wizardofOz

Well I mean for me, the RBR car is set up to cater for Max's driving style and anyone else sitting next to him has to follow suit.

last year Horner said the 2024 car is designed wrong and it gave both understeer and oversteer which means the car is wildly unpredictable. Newey later confirmed the terrible design.

but somehow Max manages to drive it but no one else can. he seems to be able to dial out the understeer and use the oversteer to his advantage. however the result is higher tire degradation.

[G30M]

Originally Posted by Killed by Death

#FerrariThings f**king up hammy's car

#CharlieThings, where you at bro

so why was the Ferrari so slow in main quali?

somehow i don't think a Ferrari is going to win the feature race ...

[G30M]

Originally Posted by Artemis

Verstappen told Dutch media the following after the Shangai qualies:

"If you looked at Liam at Racing Bulls, actually he was quite similar to Yuki [on pace]. There was not a whole lot of difference between them, I thought. Otherwise, of course, the team wouldn't make that choice to put Liam in [to Red Bull]. And now suddenly that gap is very big and they are also very close to me. So of course that tells you something. If you would put Liam in the Racing Bulls, he will go quicker."
("What’s going wrong for Liam Lawson at Red Bull?": https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/w...bull/10706032/)

maybe they should swap Yuki and Liam to check. did Max choose Liam to be his teammate I wonder.

[G30M]

the racing bull is one of the most balanced car i've seen

[G30M]

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by G30M

maybe they should swap Yuki and Liam to check. did Max choose Liam to be his teammate I wonder.

Internally, after P20 in the China qualies, the powers that be at Red Bull Racing have set the Japanese Grand Prix (Apr 6) as a deadline to decide whether they should persist with Lawson. It is told that they view it as a 'critical' test.
https://www.f1oversteer.com/news/red...d-prix-misery/