[matt_435xi]

my Z4 lease is up in 6 months so i am starting to dream about my next car. as you can see in my signature i have leased many BMWs but i want to lower my payment next go around. i do not want to go used/CPO so my requirements are a fun 4 door [sports] sedan. i love German cars, so i am thinking a new Passat or Jetta GLI. thoughts? anyone have any experience / test drives with the new VW body styles/engines? any suggestions on other 4-door cars $30k or less? thanks!

[pschnei3]

good deals going on for maxima's

[M3Bahn]

How about a Elantra GLS?
Looks better and way cheaper if you want to save some dough.

[TimZ]

How about a golf 6 gti four door?

[immiketoo]

VW makes a great car. Get a CC. They are cool.

[Bakeme521]

Originally Posted by TimZ

How about a golf 6 gti four door?

THIS! My cousin just picked one of these up for under 30k with a bunch of options in a 6 speed and he has the apr tune on, that little thing is torquey and a lot of fun to drive. It looks great too. I don't think VW is a downgrade by any means.

[Garduna]

Originally Posted by immiketoo

VW makes a great car. Get a CC. They are cool.

For sure, Passat CC with the R line bodystyle and you'll be rocking OR a 4door GTI. Can't really go wrong with either or

[mtla4]

Not really a downgrade. My 135 was my DD sold it bought a GTI(reason hated Bmw stealerships, HPFP probs, passenger door was resprayed due to an idiot in an e46 m3 that hit my door trying to impress me on the highway). The car is fun to drive, fast enough only problem insurance is double of what the 135 was.

[Q4P]

Originally Posted by mtla4

Not really a downgrade. My 135 was my DD sold it bought a GTI(reason hated Bmw stealerships, HPFP probs, passenger door was resprayed due to an idiot in an e46 m3 that hit my door trying to impress me on the highway). The car is fun to drive, fast enough only problem insurance is double of what the 135 was.

How about the fact that it's FWD, understeers, has traction problems and torque steers?

This was a downgrade for sure.

[Q4P]

Passat CC is a decent option, drove it and it feels great, just remember you are getting VW reliability which according to JD rankings is towards the bottom, not saying BMW is a shining hope of reliability but it does better than VW. My Touareg was the worst car I have ever owned in that sense.

[Inspired]

Originally Posted by Questforpower

Passat CC is a decent option, drove it and it feels great, just remember you are getting VW reliability which according to JD rankings is towards the bottom, not saying BMW is a shining hope of reliability but it does better than VW. My Touareg was the worst car I have ever owned in that sense.

One of the least reliable car on the market..

[mtla4]

Originally Posted by Questforpower

How about the fact that it's FWD, understeers, has traction problems and torque steers?

This was a downgrade for sure.

Got to adapt driving style no more 0-60 launch and no more 1st gear launch. You only nail it in 3rd. You enjoy the ride and keep money for faster and better toys. Anyhow I'm not 16 anymore dont like being noticed a 2nd-3rd-4th pull on the highway and track days are good enough for me. I'm done modding cars.

As for the understeer you have to drive like a madman to induce it on the street. Only thing that I really dislike is the wheel hop but then again you have to hammer it in the rain in order to experience that.

OP if you're looking at GTI/GLI go check out the Mazdaspeed3 way better bang for the buck out there.

P.S Vw/Audi brakes are subpar.

[matt_435xi]

Originally Posted by Paul Douglas Schneider

good deals going on for maxima's

eh, i don't like the new Maxima styling.

[matt_435xi]

Originally Posted by M3Bahn

How about a Elantra GLS?
Looks better and way cheaper if you want to save some dough.

i will check it out, not sure how a Hyundai drives as compared to a VW.

[krnboy817]

had the 2008 VW touareg before my BMW... VW was a nice car, well equipped, everyone who has been in it wanted one.

downside was 3 drive shaft replacement, 1 ball joint replacement, 2 radio unit replacement, bits and pieces of interior started rattling slowly more and more. all with in 47k miles and 1.5yrs of ownership.

VW are great cars. but i definitely say its a down grade from BMW. and price wise it may seem cheaper than a BMW but my feeling was that if BMW is selling you a 30k core value car at 40k... then VW is selling you a 20k core value car at 35k.

so when looking at just the window sticker, it is cheaper but that core value and price gap is bigger. and with all that VW incentives and marketing to sell, it only lowers your trade in value, which makes your biggest cost of ownership the, depreciation more dramatic (expensive).

at least where i live, VW dealers are the worst when it comes to service, warranty, and maintenances... little things like these just doesn't put the VW up in the same level as BMW. (not that BMW is perfect)

[matt_435xi]

Originally Posted by TimZ

How about a golf 6 gti four door?

whats the back seat like in the GTI? i was going with the (Jetta) GLI because that can fit 2 adults, i am not sure if the GTI is for kids or adults without legs?

[matt_435xi]

Originally Posted by immiketoo

VW makes a great car. Get a CC. They are cool.

CC maxed out is getting into 3 series territory.

[Q4P]

Originally Posted by mtla4

Anyhow I'm not 16 anymore dont like being noticed

OP if you're looking at GTI/GLI go check out the Mazdaspeed3 way better bang for the buck out there.

P.S Vw/Audi brakes are subpar.

First comment is a little odd coming from someone who purchased a GTI. As far as the Speed3 is concerned, I actually had that car so I can comment on it, it has the worst torque steer of any car on this planet and the traction issue is even more so multiplied when compared to the GTI.

Originally Posted by krnboy817

had the 2008 VW touareg before my BMW... VW was a nice car, well equipped, everyone who has been in it wanted one.

downside was 3 drive shaft replacement, 1 ball joint replacement, 2 radio unit replacement, bits and pieces of interior started rattling slowly more and more. all with in 47k miles and 1.5yrs of ownership.

VW are great cars. but i definitely say its a down grade from BMW. and price wise it may seem cheaper than a BMW but my feeling was that if BMW is selling you a 30k core value car at 40k... then VW is selling you a 20k core value car at 35k.

so when looking at just the window sticker, it is cheaper but that core value and price gap is bigger. and with all that VW incentives and marketing to sell, it only lowers your trade in value, which makes your biggest cost of ownership the, depreciation more dramatic (expensive).

at least where i live, VW dealers are the worst when it comes to service, warranty, and maintenances... little things like these just doesn't put the VW up in the same level as BMW. (not that BMW is perfect)

Well put, exact same experience I had!

[mtla4]

Originally Posted by Questforpower

First comment is a little odd coming from someone who purchased a GTI. As far as the Speed3 is concerned, I actually had that car so I can comment on it, it has the worst torque steer of any car on this planet and the traction issue is even more so multiplied when compared to the GTI.



Well put, exact same experience I had!

Look it did not say anything about styling bang for the buck. Aside from the gigantic trap the car looks pretty much normal most people wouldnt know the difference. My GTI is stock not even an ECU upgrade. As far as torque steer you have to adapt mazda tried doing so by limitating the car in 1-2nd. Do you race your car all day? I don't get torque steer with my car nor traction issues. Same thing goes for RWD if you push it or drive stupid you'll get oversteer and traction issues.

[Q4P]

Originally Posted by mtla4

Look it did not say anything about styling bang for the buck. Aside from the gigantic trap the car looks pretty much normal most people wouldnt know the difference. As far as torque steer you have to adapt mazda tried doing so by limitating the car in 1-2nd. Do you race your car all day? I don't get torque steer with my car nor traction issues. Same thing goes for RWD if you push it or drive stupid you'll get oversteer and traction issues.

They did limit it and it didn't help at all, anything over 4K and you are spinning like a mad man. I don't race my car all day but when you have that much TQ down low in a FWD car combined with the insanely short gearing that car had, it makes it very unpleasant to drive, that with the TQ steer in turns made it horrible. The difference between FWD and RWD is that understeer and traction loss is only manageable by slowing down or making the car not very pleasant as a DD in a FWD car, in a RWD car, its very manageable and easy.

[mtla4]

Originally Posted by krnboy817

had the 2008 VW touareg before my BMW... VW was a nice car, well equipped, everyone who has been in it wanted one.

downside was 3 drive shaft replacement, 1 ball joint replacement, 2 radio unit replacement, bits and pieces of interior started rattling slowly more and more. all with in 47k miles and 1.5yrs of ownership.

VW are great cars. but i definitely say its a down grade from BMW. and price wise it may seem cheaper than a BMW but my feeling was that if BMW is selling you a 30k core value car at 40k... then VW is selling you a 20k core value car at 35k.

so when looking at just the window sticker, it is cheaper but that core value and price gap is bigger. and with all that VW incentives and marketing to sell, it only lowers your trade in value, which makes your biggest cost of ownership the, depreciation more dramatic (expensive).

at least where i live, VW dealers are the worst when it comes to service, warranty, and maintenances... little things like these just doesn't put the VW up in the same level as BMW. (not that BMW is perfect)

Yep those are problem with vw right now I have a Hardware error code(my cd player is a goner). Peeling interior but I knew what I was getting in to not my 1st vw/audi. The GTI is probably the ONLY GERMAN CAR a the great resale value because the other ones tank pretty fast(most euro car do, looking at the Passat trade-in values is depressing). However over here service is excellent while Bmw dealerships are not the greatest.

Originally Posted by Questforpower

They did limit it and it didn't help at all, anything over 4K and you are spinning like a mad man. I don't race my car all day but when you have that much TQ down low in a FWD car combined with the insanely short gearing that car had, it makes it very unpleasant to drive, that with the TQ steer in turns made it horrible. The difference between FWD and RWD is that understeer and traction loss is only manageable by slowing down or making the car not very pleasant as a DD in a FWD car, in a RWD car, its very manageable and easy.

I agree with your post and that's the reason why the car stayed stock. I only go WOT over 3000 rpm and short shift when it gets out of control. We can agree that FWD is probably the worst configuration out there for performance-spirited driving but it's manageable. RWD is manageable but most people don't have the ability to do so.

[blue2fire]

Originally Posted by mtla4

Not really a downgrade. My 135 was my DD sold it bought a GTI(reason hated Bmw stealerships, HPFP probs, passenger door was resprayed due to an idiot in an e46 m3 that hit my door trying to impress me on the highway). The car is fun to drive, fast enough only problem insurance is double of what the 135 was.

I like the GTi, drove a few MKV's and they left me utterly cold as far as the experience but they are extremely well accomplished DD's. They are the complete opposite to a K20 Civic and just lack the X factor when you really push it, just a very boring engine with torque and not much else to distinguish it.

I don't think someone crashing into your door really should be one of the reasons?

Dealers are pretty much the same, If you dont like one you could just go a few miles and like the next one like everyone else eventually does.

The insurance thing is pretty weird considering the massive difference in the capability of both cars but non M BMW's are always pretty good with it, I guess. About HPFP problems, some have it and some don't, mine has had one precautionary change in nearly 40k miles.

Whatever, I say you will regret it OP. Just spend the extra $100 a month (if leasing again) and get what you know you want.